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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 18:16:33 GMT -5
Why do people not realize that Satan uses marriage. God ordained it. I get it.
But is it possible that maybe Satan wants God's daughters to stay in abuse so they can't even work for the Kingdom???
Can we be real about this and follow the Spirit and not the Catholic Church's lead on this?
God himself divorced Israel. Strictly discussing this topic, I'm asking, why do so many believers love to throw the God hates divorce stuff in my face???
Yes Jesus wants marriages to glorify the Trinity?
You know what dishonors God more than divorces???
Abuse! That is so ugly to the Lord.
I really think the Lord cares more about His children being free to serve Him than a state marriage license.
I mean, can we talk?
I've always thought this way and I didn't arrive at this conclusion overnight.
Someone please explain where the Bible supports bondage, abuse, and suffering in a Godly marriage?
Isn't failing to provide ....idk.... A disqualification for marital rights?
It was in Exodus and Leviticus...
But it's not today cause why? Grace?
What if grace ain't for everybody? (Hebrews 6)
Let's just think about that. Especially you church leaders.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Feb 24, 2019 18:35:44 GMT -5
Sister I’m asking this as humbly as I can. Are you asking for a dialog, or are you hoping to yell at us until we agree with you? We are not your enemy.
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Post by John on Feb 24, 2019 18:53:46 GMT -5
Naomi, I wish I could tell you what you want to hear, and I know there are many that will, but do you want the truth, or someone to lie to you? I don't like seeing you unhappy, or in bondage to a terrible marriage. I get nothing out of that. Nobody does. If people are telling you that divorce and re-marriage is wrong, except for the sake of fornication, they are only telling you what the Bible says so you will know. That way you can make an informed decision.
I want you to look carefully at what Jesus says here. If you want to have an honest discussion, lets do it based on scripture. You tell us if you believe we are misinterpreting it and why, and I will consider it. Matthew 19:3-12
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered, and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning, made them male and female? And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away/ He saith unto them, Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away, doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some Eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some Eunuchs, which were made Eunuchs of men: and there be Eunuchs, which have made themselves Eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.
This is one of the most sobering passages on the subject I know of in the Bible. Jesus addresses the law of Moses. When his disciples are in shock over what he said, and say if this is true, it is good not to marry, he doesn't give them encouragement that God will forgive divorce and re-marriage for less than Biblical grounds, but goes on about how for some, being a eunuch is an option. This isn't just some doctrine of man. This is the doctrine of Jesus. I have spent a lot of time studying this subject. I have heard people make the arguments you have, but they don't line up with the Bible. Separating is not adultery. You are not guilty of that sin, but even if your husband had walked out on you, that is not putting you away. Putting you away is filing for divorce. Anyone would have to agree with me on that point of law. It is theoretically possible to remain separated for the rest of your life without getting a divorce. My Grandparents couldn't get along, and they lived apart, but never divorced.
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Post by frienduff on Feb 24, 2019 19:09:05 GMT -5
With every ounce of my inner most being , I must agree . You may remain single , but DO NOT remarry . Hey , I been single from my wife for over fifteen years , AND I GOT ALL JOY IN THE LORD . But I must stress again . Do not remarry . You are not in adultery , UNLESS you remarry another . Let them remain single or be reconciled .
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 20:27:07 GMT -5
Sister I’m asking this as humbly as I can. Are you asking for a dialog, or are you hoping to yell at us until we agree with you? We are not your enemy. I'm just ruled by emotion at times still. Still a work in progress, those emotions. I just know women who have stayed in abuse for decades and ppl just accuse them of all these horrible things when they try to escape. It's not just about me. Women in my situation--- we know God hates divorce. It feels like salt in the wounds when I perceive that others think I'm just shopping around for a new man cause I was too lazy to make the first marriage work Those words: "greener grass". They hurt me, PG4H. Because I wanted my own grass to be green and prayed so hard and it just wasn't. I ask myself, am I a bad person for looking at the green grass or am I human?? Please talk to me in an understanding way. I want to follow the Lord. I just have mountains to climb.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 20:29:59 GMT -5
Naomi, I wish I could tell you what you want to hear, and I know there are many that will, but do you want the truth, or someone to lie to you? I don't like seeing you unhappy, or in bondage to a terrible marriage. I get nothing out of that. Nobody does. If people are telling you that divorce and re-marriage is wrong, except for the sake of fornication, they are only telling you what the Bible says so you will know. That way you can make an informed decision.
I want you to look carefully at what Jesus says here. If you want to have an honest discussion, lets do it based on scripture. You tell us if you believe we are misinterpreting it and why, and I will consider it. Matthew 19:3-12
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered, and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning, made them male and female? And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away/ He saith unto them, Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away, doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some Eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some Eunuchs, which were made Eunuchs of men: and there be Eunuchs, which have made themselves Eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.
This is one of the most sobering passages on the subject I know of in the Bible. Jesus addresses the law of Moses. When his disciples are in shock over what he said, and say if this is true, it is good not to marry, he doesn't give them encouragement that God will forgive divorce and re-marriage for less than Biblical grounds, but goes on about how for some, being a eunuch is an option. This isn't just some doctrine of man. This is the doctrine of Jesus. I have spent a lot of time studying this subject. I have heard people make the arguments you have, but they don't line up with the Bible. Separating is not adultery. You are not guilty of that sin, but even if your husband had walked out on you, that is not putting you away. Putting you away is filing for divorce. Anyone would have to agree with me on that point of law. It is theoretically possible to remain separated for the rest of your life without getting a divorce. My Grandparents couldn't get along, and they lived apart, but never divorced.
Even as you wrote that--- conviction and Revelation hit. Choosing marriage/relationships over the Lord is why we're cursed in the first place. We want what we don't have. But if the Lord told me to return to my husband... I would. He just hasn't told me that. He told me to wait and see. And He keeps hinting that there is great reward in obeying that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 20:32:59 GMT -5
Naomi, I wish I could tell you what you want to hear, and I know there are many that will, but do you want the truth, or someone to lie to you? I don't like seeing you unhappy, or in bondage to a terrible marriage. I get nothing out of that. Nobody does. If people are telling you that divorce and re-marriage is wrong, except for the sake of fornication, they are only telling you what the Bible says so you will know. That way you can make an informed decision.
I want you to look carefully at what Jesus says here. If you want to have an honest discussion, lets do it based on scripture. You tell us if you believe we are misinterpreting it and why, and I will consider it. Matthew 19:3-12
The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered, and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning, made them male and female? And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away/ He saith unto them, Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away, doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some Eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some Eunuchs, which were made Eunuchs of men: and there be Eunuchs, which have made themselves Eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.
This is one of the most sobering passages on the subject I know of in the Bible. Jesus addresses the law of Moses. When his disciples are in shock over what he said, and say if this is true, it is good not to marry, he doesn't give them encouragement that God will forgive divorce and re-marriage for less than Biblical grounds, but goes on about how for some, being a eunuch is an option. This isn't just some doctrine of man. This is the doctrine of Jesus. I have spent a lot of time studying this subject. I have heard people make the arguments you have, but they don't line up with the Bible. Separating is not adultery. You are not guilty of that sin, but even if your husband had walked out on you, that is not putting you away. Putting you away is filing for divorce. Anyone would have to agree with me on that point of law. It is theoretically possible to remain separated for the rest of your life without getting a divorce. My Grandparents couldn't get along, and they lived apart, but never divorced.
I shouldn't have married. I really got the crumbs of the marriage. The Lord must think I'm strong. I'm not. I need help. Like a lot. Glad I went to Church today
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Post by 2fw8212a on Feb 24, 2019 20:38:30 GMT -5
I'm just ruled by emotion at times still. Still a work in progress, those emotions. I just know women who have stayed in abuse for decades and ppl just accuse them of all these horrible things when they try to escape. It's not just about me. Women in my situation--- we know God hates divorce. It feels like salt in the wounds when I perceive that others think I'm just shopping around for a new man cause I was too lazy to make the first marriage work Those words: "greener grass". They hurt me, PG4H. Because I wanted my own grass to be green and prayed so hard and it just wasn't. I ask myself, am I a bad person for looking at the green grass or am I human?? Please talk to me in an understanding way. I want to follow the Lord. I just have mountains to climb. The problem is not to depart because they are being abused. The problem is to marry another.
I understand that staying alone is a hard saying for most people (it was to me).
But people cannot just throw the Lord's own word in the garbage just because they do not want to see them alone.
"He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me.
And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." - Matthew 10:37
This just shows how serious marriage is in the sight of the Lord and how irresponsible people are in treating it as something disposable.
By experience I must say that you can be happy single, if you choose so, but another marriage without the approval of the Lord is not going to be better.
Or you pray for your husband and fight for him, or you keep at a distance and remain single (while praying if you wish).
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 20:47:30 GMT -5
I'm just ruled by emotion at times still. Still a work in progress, those emotions. I just know women who have stayed in abuse for decades and ppl just accuse them of all these horrible things when they try to escape. It's not just about me. Women in my situation--- we know God hates divorce. It feels like salt in the wounds when I perceive that others think I'm just shopping around for a new man cause I was too lazy to make the first marriage work Those words: "greener grass". They hurt me, PG4H. Because I wanted my own grass to be green and prayed so hard and it just wasn't. I ask myself, am I a bad person for looking at the green grass or am I human?? Please talk to me in an understanding way. I want to follow the Lord. I just have mountains to climb. The problem is not to depart because they are being abused. The problem is to marry another.
I understand that staying alone is a hard saying for most people (it was to me).
But people cannot just throw the Lord's own word in the garbage just because they do not want to see them alone.
"He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me.
And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." - Matthew 10:37
This just shows how serious marriage is in the sight of the Lord and how irresponsible people are in treating it as something disposable.
By experience I must say that you can be happy single, if you choose so, but another marriage without the approval of the Lord is not going to be better.
Or you pray for your husband and fight for him, or you keep at a distance and remain single (while praying if you wish).Thank you for not telling me as if it's easy. Cause it's not. I just feel it's unfair cause my husband pressured me into marrying him before I could think clearly about it. He lied about being this manly man who'd make my life happier. It's not fair because of one season of confusion and pressure, I may have to be single my whole life. That's just so... I just feel like God's word is mocking me. Like I make one mistake at 19 years old and I just pay for it by essentially being a nun my whole life. Only for Jesus do I accept. But y'all? Some of y'all, no offense, act like the flesh doesn't exist at all and it still does for me. Suffering and death and joy. I only trust the Lord. I don't know all of your intentions. But best believe I will be reading Scripture for myself.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Feb 24, 2019 21:08:07 GMT -5
Like I make one mistake at 19 years old and I just pay for it by essentially being a nun my whole life. Well, the consequences of our past decisions may still affect us.
It is just as if I had lost one leg while having fun at a party... I will have to live without the leg for the rest of my life.
"And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell." - Matthew 5:30Some of y'all, no offense, act like the flesh doesn't exist at all and it still does for me. Suffering and death and joy. I only trust the Lord. I don't know all of your intentions. But best believe I will be reading Scripture for myself. We all have suffered here, and I know what you may be experiencing.
"...for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin..." - 1 Peter 4:1
I never had a woman in my life at all, then I will never know how it is to go out and have fun with many women at every corner for example.
But is that a loss?! Seriously, is that a loss?! Obviously not. I am not losing anything.
"Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ..." - Philippians 3:8
And if I want to have a woman in my life, I will have to stay with that single woman for the whole life.
And now, what would people say?! Just one woman your whole life?! Why you do not go back to the world and have fun with some more?!
Seriously, is that a loss?! The enemy may want to make us believe it is... But that is not a loss at all, and I have learned this.
"The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever; The judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether." - Psalm 19:9
"Moreover by them Your servant is warned, And in keeping them there is great reward." - Psalm 19:11
Blessings!
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Cletus
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Post by Cletus on Feb 24, 2019 22:18:42 GMT -5
Why do people not realize that Satan uses marriage. God ordained it. I get it. But is it possible that maybe Satan wants God's daughters to stay in abuse so they can't even work for the Kingdom??? Can we be real about this and follow the Spirit and not the Catholic Church's lead on this? God himself divorced Israel. Strictly discussing this topic, I'm asking, why do so many believers love to throw the God hates divorce stuff in my face??? Yes Jesus wants marriages to glorify the Trinity? You know what dishonors God more than divorces??? Abuse! That is so ugly to the Lord. I really think the Lord cares more about His children being free to serve Him than a state marriage license. I mean, can we talk? I've always thought this way and I didn't arrive at this conclusion overnight. Someone please explain where the Bible supports bondage, abuse, and suffering in a Godly marriage? Isn't failing to provide ....idk.... A disqualification for marital rights? It was in Exodus and Leviticus... But it's not today cause why? Grace? What if grace ain't for everybody? (Hebrews 6) Let's just think about that. Especially you church leaders. I do not think failing to provide is a disqualification to marital rights. A marriage isnt about rights. its about honoring a vow to God, and to your husband/wife. The world looks at it in the light of rights... entitlement, etc.
I am not trying to justify not providing as the bible does say if you dont provide you are worse than an infidel. and even then, the world twists that scripture. providing dont mean the man provides the life/lifestyle you thought you would always have and if not the man gets put out.... and i do not speak that directly to you Naomi, but as a general statement. broadly speaking, to all people. your situation what i just said isnt a real good fit, and i am just saying how that scripture is twisted.
consider this... God is our husband. He commands us to live holy. but he does not force us to. if we want to walk away from Him, if we choose to go back into the world... He lets us. Not only by who He is, but also what He has done... He should have every right of His bride. but He gives commands and we obey or we do not. What about His rights? do you see what I am saying? I mean, He was crucified. nails thru hands and feet into a tree. crown of thorns. cat-o-nine. He bought us with His own blood... what was already His. can you imagine you own a car, and then you have to buy it again? I would be like naw buddy i got the title right here... but God. But God. Hallelujah!
I do not think anyone here is going to throw stones at you. I would recommend maybe not telling so many people your business so they cant throw God hates divorce in your face. Maybe only speak on it if it can edify someone. I dont know pray about it if you think you should. I read your posts from the other forum. I know your nerves were shot. you were at your limit. I know you tried. I know you didnt have anyone to go to. I know lots of people were lifting you up in prayer. If i know this what does God know? You do not have to justify yourself to any man. You are not perfect, nor am i. neither is life or this world. Just set your heart on living for God. do your best and let God do the rest.
we are finite beings. and we all have our limits. God understands our hearts from a far off.
i am not saying i support that you left... but i am also not judging you either. I always liked you as a sister. but once you started posting all that stuff God gave you a special place in my heart. i prayed for you a lot.
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Post by John on Feb 24, 2019 23:01:49 GMT -5
The problem is not to depart because they are being abused. The problem is to marry another.
I understand that staying alone is a hard saying for most people (it was to me).
But people cannot just throw the Lord's own word in the garbage just because they do not want to see them alone.
"He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me.
And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." - Matthew 10:37
This just shows how serious marriage is in the sight of the Lord and how irresponsible people are in treating it as something disposable.
By experience I must say that you can be happy single, if you choose so, but another marriage without the approval of the Lord is not going to be better.
Or you pray for your husband and fight for him, or you keep at a distance and remain single (while praying if you wish). Thank you for not telling me as if it's easy. Cause it's not. I just feel it's unfair cause my husband pressured me into marrying him before I could think clearly about it. He lied about being this manly man who'd make my life happier. It's not fair because of one season of confusion and pressure, I may have to be single my whole life. That's just so... I just feel like God's word is mocking me. Like I make one mistake at 19 years old and I just pay for it by essentially being a nun my whole life. Only for Jesus do I accept. But y'all? Some of y'all, no offense, act like the flesh doesn't exist at all and it still does for me. Suffering and death and joy. I only trust the Lord. I don't know all of your intentions. But best believe I will be reading Scripture for myself. I know the flesh exists, and I know you are going through a very hard time. I also know that the devil will play on us when we are in a hard place like that, and will cause us to sin if we are not careful. That is the only reason I have been encouraging you to use extreme caution. I want you to read the scripture for yourself. I try to get everyone to do that.
You come across to me as a very sincere person, and I like you a lot. I have no desire to see you unhappy, as I have already stated. I am trying to help you avoid doing things that could make you feel worse than you do now. I get what you are saying about being a young girl and making a mistake, and now you have to live with it. It is not like I don't understand and don't feel for you, because I do. I just know that if you will trust in God, do things his way, you will find far more happiness and contentment. I believe he has good things in store for you, and I have no idea whether or not things might occur where you will be free to be married again. I can't see into the future, but I know that you will be much happier to follow the Lord as he leads. It may come across like I am being hard nosed and uncaring, but that is not the case. I really do feel for you. I am also very happy you stopped by today. As I said before, I am not here to condemn you. I am not looking to condemn you no matter what you choose to do, but I must be honest with you. If I can't be honest with you, I am not any good to the Lord, and I am not doing you any favors either. Take care sister. Focus on yourself right now. Don't worry about tomorrow. Just seek out what the Lord says in the Bible so you will know the truth, and follow the Lord's leading.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2019 5:49:47 GMT -5
One day at a time, I suppose.
Sometimes Life just isn't fair.
If he had tried just a tad bit harder, I would have kept working. I could have supported us both.
But it was too much for me.
Today I have a job interview at McDonald's (I'm actually very happy about that) and am meeting with my outpatient help team.
It's as if the Lord holds my head up and I appear to have a very strong presence of Him. But the very moment my eyes aren't on Him, my heart re-breaks.
Perhaps I'll have a good counselor among my services so I won't have to cry all over the forums.
Thanks for supporting me and being real.
The Lord sustains. I would trade my situation but not the indwelling of the Spirit.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Feb 25, 2019 7:49:24 GMT -5
Tabitha3319 I wish the best for you. It’s clear that you are hurting and emotional. Work on getting yourself better.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2019 8:51:35 GMT -5
Tabitha3319 I wish the best for you. It’s clear that you are hurting and emotional. Work on getting yourself better. I need to stay off forums after 7pm. I'm not a night person ; ). Today will be good though. Perhaps through this trial, many will be saved. That's my prayer this morning.
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