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Post by frienduff on Jul 23, 2019 15:57:36 GMT -5
We do need to caution that we don’t become so paranoid about expressions of worship we may not understand. if a demon has gotten to the point of preaching the gospel and exhorting repentance, it has truly lost the plot. Demons give themselves away. I don’t sit around in church service questioning if every little utterance is a demon in disguise. Paul did not give any such warning to Corinth. Ed Zachary dear sister . You know what I test , THE FRUITS of said persons . ITS the FRUITS that will show what tree one is truly of . For the fruit of the wicked is to sin . You just leap up and praise the LORD sister . In fact , let butero and all of us , JUST PRAISE THE LORD .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2019 8:25:10 GMT -5
When we're arguing with minds of flesh it often doesn't seem as though we're making any dents, and sometimes it can even cause their mind to dig into it's preferred position all the harder. But its' the heart that matters far more and it can take time for the word of God to sprout and grow in the heart after it's been planted. And then it can take time for the mind to catch up with what the heart knows...that's why we sometimes see people sort of contradicting themselves without realizing it. So maybe it's just a good time to leave it in God's hands for the dust to settle and for Him to give the increase, and we could just give reminders of His word now and then in the meantime without going loggerheads. People are often slow or reluctant to openly back down from a position, or even to themselves privately, when they have been arguing so vehemently in public about a point....they sometimes need time to catch up with themselves, and time and space for the Lord to work on them. We are not always the best judges of how effective we've been because fruit takes time to grow and we often might not know until eternity who was helped by something we said. I don't who is cessationist over there any more, some of the ones I used to know are gone....but they are the ones in the biggest trouble I think. The big scandal that broke recently regarding the Southern Baptist church...is God exposing and judging that house. They are cessationists and so they don't believe in being filled with the Holy Spirit......and if they don't have Him in these last days they are just sunk. I'm pretty sure cessationism can be considered to be an outright false gospel....it's such a huge and destructive lie.....without the Holy Spirit they just can't seem to perceive and apprehend the truth no matter how simple and plain it is shown to them. Okay, so you believe in the gifts of the Spirit. My husband and I used to go to a church where they said speaking in tongues was THE evidence of salvation. I didn't like it. Sister, I just believe everything that scripture speaks of regarding the Holy Spirit....that the ministry of the Holy Spirit has never ceased and that we still need Him today as much as ever....maybe more than ever. We can't understand the the things of the Spirit without the Spirit....we need Him, and we also need to learn to rely on Him. Well, what I understand from scripture about tongues and all the gifts is that nobody has all the gifts.....different gifts are given to different parts of the Body, so that the whole Body may be built up. Not everyone has the gift of tongues, just like not everyone has the gift of helps or of prophecy or of evangelism, etc. There is nothing in the bible about needing "evidence" of salvation.....only that "by their fruits you will know them". I don't believe we are to think in terms of being obligated to supply "proof" of our salvation to men....it's to our own Master we stand or fall, because we are His servants. I feel so sorry for anyone who believes they need to somehow work up a gift that God didn't give them otherwise they are left in doubt about their salvation...that is a diabolical teaching.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Jul 24, 2019 9:42:13 GMT -5
I feel so sorry for anyone who believes they need to somehow work up a gift that God didn't give them otherwise they are left in doubt about their salvation...that is a diabolical teaching. I would not go so far.
To me, some people have this understanding because that is how it happened to them.
The mistake is to think that just because others do not speak in tongues it means they are not saved.
I believe it is just ignorance, not necessarily diabolical.
Just as there are people who say that you MUST speak in tongues when you are baptized with the Holy Spirit.
That is not true. I have been baptized and never spoke with tongues and yet no one receive my testimony.
To me, some people just have a distorted understanding of what the baptism with the Holy Spirit really is.
But people who spoke in tongues when they experienced it will hardly accept a different testimony.
“And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know.” - 1 Corinthians 8:2
It is a similar case of people demanding others to speak tongues as a proof of their salvation.
They are just expecting others will experience and behave exactly like them when they were saved.
“Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?” - 1 Corinthians 12:30
“Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them...” - Romans 12:6
“I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...earnestly desire the best gifts. And yet I show you a more excellent way.” - 1 Corinthians 12:31
“Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,
but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.” - 1 Corinthians 13:1
“And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.” - 1 Corinthians 13:13
“Therefore by their fruits you will know them.” - Matthew 7:20
Blessings!
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Post by frienduff on Jul 24, 2019 12:17:13 GMT -5
I feel so sorry for anyone who believes they need to somehow work up a gift that God didn't give them otherwise they are left in doubt about their salvation...that is a diabolical teaching. I would not go so far.
To me, some people have this understanding because that is how it happened to them.
The mistake is to think that just because others do not speak in tongues it means they are not saved.
I believe it is just ignorance, not necessarily diabolical.
Just as there are people who say that you MUST speak in tongues when you are baptized with the Holy Spirit.
That is not true. I have been baptized and never spoke with tongues and yet no one receive my testimony.
To me, some people just have a distorted understanding of what the baptism with the Holy Spirit really is.
But people who spoke in tongues when they experienced it will hardly accept a different testimony.
“And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know.” - 1 Corinthians 8:2
It is a similar case of people demanding others to speak tongues as a proof of their salvation.
They are just expecting others will experience and behave exactly like them when they were saved.
“Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?” - 1 Corinthians 12:30
“Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them...” - Romans 12:6
“I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...earnestly desire the best gifts. And yet I show you a more excellent way.” - 1 Corinthians 12:31
“Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,
but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.” - 1 Corinthians 13:1
“And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.” - 1 Corinthians 13:13
“Therefore by their fruits you will know them.” - Matthew 7:20
Blessings!And have peace and rest n this letters . We all love you my brother of many letters . And not a one of us thinks you are not saved , just because you have not spoke in tongues . You have peace in that . Its the fruits I examine . Folks have actually accused me , just because I spoke ONLY ONCE with tongues the night I received the Holy ghost . ANd yet have never spoken since . They say I have not faith because I did not continue to speak with tongues or words to that effect . YOU KNOW WHY I HAVE ALL PEACE , because what do words and thoughts of others matter to MY FAITH . I MEAN I KNOW WHO I SERVE , so why worry if others think I don't . NOW PUT THOSE HANDS UP LETTERS . YOU ARE LOVED and I don't care what the Vatican might say about you in the days to come , YOU are loved my friend . HANDS UP and let all REJOICE IN THE LORD .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2019 14:09:02 GMT -5
I feel so sorry for anyone who believes they need to somehow work up a gift that God didn't give them otherwise they are left in doubt about their salvation...that is a diabolical teaching. I would not go so far.
To me, some people have this understanding because that is how it happened to them.
The mistake is to think that just because others do not speak in tongues it means they are not saved.
I believe it is just ignorance, not necessarily diabolical.
Just as there are people who say that you MUST speak in tongues when you are baptized with the Holy Spirit.
That is not true. I have been baptized and never spoke with tongues and yet no one receive my testimony.
To me, some people just have a distorted understanding of what the baptism with the Holy Spirit really is.
But people who spoke in tongues when they experienced it will hardly accept a different testimony.
“And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know.” - 1 Corinthians 8:2
It is a similar case of people demanding others to speak tongues as a proof of their salvation.
They are just expecting others will experience and behave exactly like them when they were saved.
“Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?” - 1 Corinthians 12:30
“Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them...” - Romans 12:6
“I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets...” - 1 Corinthians 14:5
“...earnestly desire the best gifts. And yet I show you a more excellent way.” - 1 Corinthians 12:31
“Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,
but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.” - 1 Corinthians 13:1
“And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.” - 1 Corinthians 13:13
“Therefore by their fruits you will know them.” - Matthew 7:20
Blessings!I think you are talking about individual believers brother, but I was talking about instances where it is being taught in churches as false doctrine.....it can destroy the faith of those who do not speak in tongues, if they believe it means they aren't saved. And even at best it throws everything off kilter in those churches.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Jul 24, 2019 14:15:32 GMT -5
I think you are talking about individual believers brother, but I was talking about instances where it is being taught in churches as false doctrine..... it can destroy the faith of those who do not speak in tongues, if they believe it means they aren't saved. And even at best it throws everything off kilter in those churches. That is why the Lord reveals the truth. Though those churches are not doing it with evil intent.
I know how it is to feel like that, despised or even thinking that you were rejected by the Lord because you do not speak tongues.
And those who need the truth about this matter will receive it.
Blessings!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2019 14:56:38 GMT -5
I think you are talking about individual believers brother, but I was talking about instances where it is being taught in churches as false doctrine..... it can destroy the faith of those who do not speak in tongues, if they believe it means they aren't saved. And even at best it throws everything off kilter in those churches. That is why the Lord reveals the truth. Though those churches are not doing it with evil intent.
I know how it is to feel like that, despised or even thinking that you were rejected by the Lord because you do not speak tongues.
And those who need the truth about this matter will receive it.
Blessings!I agree with you completely about the gift of tongues Letters. Just that I consider this to be a serious lie and departure from the gospel, like so many other lies that are causing the church to fall away.
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Post by frienduff on Jul 24, 2019 18:33:09 GMT -5
That is why the Lord reveals the truth. Though those churches are not doing it with evil intent.
I know how it is to feel like that, despised or even thinking that you were rejected by the Lord because you do not speak tongues.
And those who need the truth about this matter will receive it.
Blessings! I agree with you completely about the gift of tongues Letters. Just that I consider this to be a serious lie and departure from the gospel, like so many other lies that are causing the church to fall away. Sister I must have missed something . What is it that you consider to be a serious lie and departure from the gospel , is it when folks say the gifts are over etc . YES THIS IS A LIE . And it is a serious one at that . I wonder how many have Blasphmed the actual HOLY SPIRIT by saying all tongues is fake . I mean if an operation is being done BY the SPIRIT and one says its of demonic nature , IS THAT not blaspheming the HOLY GHOST . JESUS cast out demons and they accused HIS WORK of the SPIRIT as being of demonic nature . AND THAT was WHAT JESUS called THE actual blasphemy of the HOLY GHOST . Now , believe me , I seen some barkng like dogs and rolling around and being walked on leashes etc AND THAT IS NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT . But we better be careful to not accuse the work of the SPIRIT . THAT is a deadly thing to do . AND many main leaders who teach that cessation BETTER WATCH OUT , because I just wonder how many of them HAVE already BLASPHMED the WORKS which ONLY THE SPIRIT can give a man to do . THEY BETTER WATCH OUT MAN .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2019 20:15:42 GMT -5
I agree with you completely about the gift of tongues Letters. Just that I consider this to be a serious lie and departure from the gospel, like so many other lies that are causing the church to fall away. Sister I must have missed something . What is it that you consider to be a serious lie and departure from the gospel , is it when folks say the gifts are over etc . YES THIS IS A LIE . And it is a serious one at that . I wonder how many have Blasphmed the actual HOLY SPIRIT by saying all tongues is fake . I mean if an operation is being done BY the SPIRIT and one says its of demonic nature , IS THAT not blaspheming the HOLY GHOST . JESUS cast out demons and they accused HIS WORK of the SPIRIT as being of demonic nature . AND THAT was WHAT JESUS called THE actual blasphemy of the HOLY GHOST . Now , believe me , I seen some barkng like dogs and rolling around and being walked on leashes etc AND THAT IS NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT . But we better be careful to not accuse the work of the SPIRIT . THAT is a deadly thing to do . AND many main leaders who teach that cessation BETTER WATCH OUT , because I just wonder how many of them HAVE already BLASPHMED the WORKS which ONLY THE SPIRIT can give a man to do . THEY BETTER WATCH OUT MAN .
I was referring to the lie that some churches teach that the "evidence" of salvation is speaking in tongues.....it leaves some people in doubt about their salvation or thinking that they have to produce tongues in order to be saved.....shipwrecked faith in both instances. But you are so right......it is possible that cessationists might be blaspheming the Holy Spirit. Though God in His mercy may cause some of them not to say anything...I have noticed that at times, how people sometimes stop short at that point....God's mercy.
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Post by Tabitha3319 on Jul 25, 2019 21:23:08 GMT -5
Yesterday, my husband and I were invited to a Holiness Pentecostal church by one of his clients.
Hubby seems interested so I've decided to keep an open mind.
Understand, that other church we went to where they said speaking in tongues was THE evidence of salvation scared me away from churches that allow speaking in tongues.
But I don't want to shut myself off from something good just because of a bad experience.
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Post by John on Jul 25, 2019 21:32:18 GMT -5
Yesterday, my husband and I were invited to a Holiness Pentecostal church by one of his clients. Hubby seems interested so I've decided to keep an open mind. Understand, that other church we went to where they said speaking in tongues was THE evidence of salvation scared me away from churches that allow speaking in tongues. But I don't want to shut myself off from something good just because of a bad experience. I would consider trying a church like that. The ones that say tongues is necessary for salvation are generally Apostolic Churches. There is nothing to lose in checking it out. Let us know how it goes?
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Post by Tabitha3319 on Jul 25, 2019 22:24:15 GMT -5
Yesterday, my husband and I were invited to a Holiness Pentecostal church by one of his clients. Hubby seems interested so I've decided to keep an open mind. Understand, that other church we went to where they said speaking in tongues was THE evidence of salvation scared me away from churches that allow speaking in tongues. But I don't want to shut myself off from something good just because of a bad experience. I would consider trying a church like that. The ones that say tongues is necessary for salvation are generally Apostolic Churches. There is nothing to lose in checking it out. Let us know how it goes? Sure! I will share how it goes
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Post by frienduff on Jul 26, 2019 19:56:29 GMT -5
Sister NAOMINASH , IS LOVED .
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Post by frienduff on Jul 27, 2019 13:19:36 GMT -5
That's right sister naominash . THE LORD has been working on you dear sister . just as HE has on us all . YOU be encouraged . And you are LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVED .
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