|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 12:21:06 GMT -5
In regard to the poll question, if you attend any physical house of worship besides a home church, that counts as a traditional church. If you attend a traditional church, what keeps you going there? What do you like? Do you dislike anything?
If you do not attend a traditional church, did you ever? If you did attend a traditional church in the past, were you heavily involved in ministry there? To those who used to attend a traditional church, but don't anymore, what are the things you found so objectionable that you left? I am looking for as much information as you are willing to share.
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 12:54:58 GMT -5
I will start this rolling. I grew up United Methodist. I left it because of their connection to the World Counsel of Churches. After seeking a church for sometime, I joined a Pentecostal Holiness Church. At the time, I enjoyed going to church. I went to all 3 services and was very involved. I did pretty much whatever was asked of me. I liked the hymns, and the hand clapping during the songs, as well as the praise and worship. I liked the Preacher and his wife and the members. I couldn't imagine ever leaving at the time. The church was growing. There was about 85 on Sunday mornings. Here is what happened.
There was internal fighting I didn't know about, and the Pastor decided to leave. There was a failing Assemblies of God in town running about 8 people, and the Pastor took it, along with the new converts at the PHC. I went with him. He started to gradually change his doctrine after that. He started moving from holiness doctrine to more like word of faith, and there were times he was stealing messages from televangelists like Benny Hinn. The music went from traditional hymns to praise choruses that would seem to go on forever. Still, we remained.
He split up with his wife, and then got close to much more liberal seeker friendly types. After his divorce, he was forced out of the AOG and started an Independent church taking about 2/3 of that congregation. We stayed with him. Later he re-married, and got even more liberal to where you couldn't recognize this was the same man. I hated church by then and only remained because I had been made to believe it was God's will and I would be in rebellion to leave. I re-read the Bible to determine if he was right or I was, and it confirmed for me that his message was false. The very last straw for me was the way he let the worship leaders come to church. You had a man with long hair coming to church in shorts playing the drums and the female worship leader wearing jeans. After that, I told him I was leaving.
I went to other churches after that, but never found one I liked going to. There was another Pentecostal Holiness Church I attended for a while, but once that Pastor retired, the next guy was liberal. That is how it all started. If there was a physical church that was like the PHC was when I first started going there in 1983, I would gladly go there.
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 13:04:14 GMT -5
Traditional church was never a place I attended for learning or personal growth. For me, it was always pretty much putting in face time on Sunday and having a place to pay my tithes. I developed my own prayer circle, support group, and teaching sources which were not tied into a local congregation. That way my support system wouldn’t be threatened by a schism or closure of a church. Hard lessons learned growing up as a preacher’s kid.
In other words I submitted to being discipled, but not through an institution. When I was a member of various churches, I did the book clubs, study groups, game nights, all of these things. It was mostly for socializing in a Christian environment. I can’t say I ever learned a whole lot in any of those meetings. Not that I was too good to learn. I wasn’t trying not to learn. I just caught on pretty quick that my own personal discipleship journey was not being touched in these meetings.
For quite a few years I lived parallel lives as a Christian. During the week I experienced prophetic words, miraculous healings, and deep revelations of Scripture. A friend would come over Friday night, and we’d be on our faces in worship together. Then on Sunday morning I reported to a building, sat quietly for two hours, and did nothing. As long as the service was tolerable enough that I could survive it, I kept going.
The last time hubby and I walked out of a mainstream service, we both had splitting headaches, and we physically dreaded the thought of coming back next Sunday. I told him I was done. Back at home, we did some online searching for a new church. They were all cookie cutter. Same marketing, same language, same everything. I told him I was not driving across town on another goose chase for another bad church. He agreed, and we haven’t attended church since.
when we left that church, I was concerned that perhaps I was being too picky. So I logged in at worthy to ask other Christians if a splitting headache and a demoralized mood every single Sunday were bad enough to quit a church. while I was there I met John and frienduff, and the rest is history. That was about 18 months ago.
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 13:22:46 GMT -5
On the question of whether I would attend a good conventional church again… at this time I honestly can’t say I would. Too many bad memories, too much worry that it isn’t what it seems, and too much hassle of getting up Sunday morning for something only halfway decent. In other words I guess it would take too much to convince me it’s really a good church.
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 13:33:52 GMT -5
On the question of whether I would attend a good conventional church again… at this time I honestly can’t say I would. Too many bad memories, too much worry that it isn’t what it seems, and too much hassle of getting up Sunday morning for something only halfway decent. In other words I guess it would take too much to convince me it’s really a good church. Considering you have never had a memory of going to a church you liked, I fully understand. Something you said does cause me to have a follow up question. You mentioned having what amounts to church in your home between Sunday services. If church was like what you were experiencing at home, I would assume you would like that? You experienced God. That is a difference. When I went to the church I liked, we had people healed and delivered from demonic possession. God was there, but that changed. I fully understand that major difference, but why do you suppose you had a move of God at home and God seems to have left traditional churches today?
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 13:59:47 GMT -5
From my childhood I do of course have memories of being in services were the Lord was present. I have a very clear memory of being six or seven years old and demanding for our pastor to baptize me. He said I wasn’t ready, but I badgered him until I talked him into it. I remember him kneeling before me asking me if I promised to be a good girl. I said yes of course, and he agreed to baptize me. I actually haven’t been baptized since.
Even for pastors who start out with good intentions these days, if they’re part of a denomination, that denomination will be working against them on many biblical fronts. The only conventional church I would consider joining in the future would be a totally independent group who purchased a building or found some other public meeting place. I would be highly vigilant of the pastor’s wife and other influential women to look for signs of a feminist streak. The pastor would have to demonstrate that his flock has been experiencing prophecy and other true moves of the Lord. His children would have to present themselves as being proper and respectful. Too many pastors are trying to make it work with cracks in their armor.
A church with a crack will be undone in the end. No matter the enthusiasm, good intentions, or anything else, cracks don’t go unnoticed in the spirit world. When people point cracks out, they are typically accused of nitpicking. But those cracks eventually result in a pastor storming out or a church splitting up or something. Paul said our works are tried by fire, and straw doesn’t make it. The fire is coming to every church and every ministry, sometimes ready or not. Those tiny little sentences in Scripture are really a huge deal, and when I see a church dismiss them, I see a church about to implode.
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 14:12:10 GMT -5
All that you said makes good sense. I am trying to figure out why God seems to have left most of the churches, yet we still experience His presence outside the church? Is it sin in the camp? Is it churches quenching the Spirit by being so scripted, He can't move? Is it lack of faith?
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 14:16:30 GMT -5
Simply put, any church aligned with a denomination today is basically a franchise for a corporation selling Jesus.
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 14:24:15 GMT -5
Rick Warren makes no secret of this. He described the purpose driven church network as a franchise system offering the same repeatable, predictable experience. Just like you go into any Chick-fil-A in the country, and you know what a Chick-fil-A will be like, the goal is to have familiar branding from one church to the next. Warren said this was optimal because the geniuses at the top will do all the work of creating the brand and developing the methods. Then any church could use the system, and whoever they had available with whatever talent could be plugged into the process. This is why the music sounds exactly the same in every church.
|
|
|
Post by preciouspearl on Oct 2, 2019 14:32:31 GMT -5
Hebrews 10:25 King James Version (KJV) 25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. i go to a church and meet christian friends to assemble with them regardless to help exhort and seek encouragement.
we wont always agree. im for churches that support missionaries, and different ministries and if they have any ministries for family, singles, teens, etc i will likely not mind even giving financial support
|
|
PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
|
Post by PG4Him on Oct 2, 2019 14:36:35 GMT -5
The last church we attended was a Church of God. The pastor used to mentioned how the denomination was always emailing him sermon ideas, study materials, etc. I specifically remember him preaching things he found verbatim on the Internet. One time in the middle of Philippians he started quoting from an article he read in Charisma. Written by a woman. I remember telling hubby I could’ve stayed home to read Charisma for myself.
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 14:44:28 GMT -5
Hebrews 10:25 King James Version (KJV) 25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. i go to a church and meet christian friends to assemble with them regardless to help exhort and seek encouragement. we wont always agree. im for churches that support missionaries, and different ministries and if they have any ministries for family, singles, teens, etc i will likely not mind even giving financial support Thank you Pearl for your input and for voting in the poll. I am trying to learn from everyone.
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 14:45:36 GMT -5
Hebrews 10:25 King James Version (KJV) 25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. i go to a church and meet christian friends to assemble with them regardless to help exhort and seek encouragement. we wont always agree. im for churches that support missionaries, and different ministries and if they have any ministries for family, singles, teens, etc i will likely not mind even giving financial support Are you in a denominational or independent church?
|
|
|
Post by John on Oct 2, 2019 14:47:11 GMT -5
The last church we attended was a Church of God. The pastor used to mentioned how the denomination was always emailing him sermon ideas, study materials, etc. I specifically remember him preaching things he found verbatim on the Internet. One time in the middle of Philippians he started quoting from an article he read in Charisma. Written by a woman. I remember telling hubby I could’ve stayed home to read Charisma for myself. I saw my Pastor preach the exact same thing Benny Hinn preached on TBN the same week.
|
|
|
Post by preciouspearl on Oct 2, 2019 14:57:25 GMT -5
i go to a non denominational and an independent fundamental baptist
|
|