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Post by 4hizglory37 on Oct 14, 2019 21:09:55 GMT -5
Hello brothers and sisters in Christ,
I just was wondering of this question I had.....it is concerning women pastors. I was a little unsure but I think this woman really nailed it on the head for me. A few years ago while visiting my in-laws, we went to their church and there was a woman pastor. When she introduced herself to me as the pastor, I heard in my spirit that "She had stolen this position from her husband!" I was struggling about this more recently, because I went to visit a church that had a woman pastor. This church exactly represents the church in Revelation 2. Please watch and tell me what you think.
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Post by John on Oct 14, 2019 21:14:24 GMT -5
I will check it out. It is entirely possible that a woman could have usurped the position from her husband. That would be wrong in any case. I am not 100 percent against women being a Pastor as a divine calling. They could possibly serve along side of their husband if he is in charge of the church. They could possibly be a Pastor over a group of women or children. The biggest issue to me is that of being the chief authority figure. I don't believe women are to run a church.
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Post by John on Oct 14, 2019 22:01:51 GMT -5
I think there is a lot of truth in what she said. I have never thought about Jezebel being a demon, but that does make sense. I know that what most refer to as a Jezebel spirit has to do with women taking on the role of men and usurping the authority of men, often times their husbands. There are clearly gender roles in the Bible, and I also agree with her about women today dressing as men. I have been coming against that for years. All of these things are the result of feminism.
Back to the issue of women Pastors, there is no question that women are not qualified to act as the authority in a church. I would have to also agree that when you consider the authority issue, it is impossible for women to be a Pastor over a congregation without taking on the role of the authority over men, so I do see a problem there. That would mean that if a woman were a Pastor, it would have to be limited to serving as a leader over other women, perhaps training them up as to how to be Godly wives and Mothers, or teaching a children's church or something like that. It is interesting how God showed her all of this in a dream, but what she said does line up with scripture, so I can't really argue with it. Thanks for posting this.
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Post by 4hizglory37 on Oct 14, 2019 22:20:42 GMT -5
I find it so like God to answer this question that just came up for me in the last week! I had been trying to fast and pray over this because I was even considering going to that church with the woman pastor in the evenings..... so the Lord surely showed me a definite NO NO....
I am wondering though why He had me go there in the first place?
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Post by John on Oct 14, 2019 22:41:33 GMT -5
I find it so like God to answer this question that just came up for me in the last week! I had been trying to fast and pray over this because I was even considering going to that church with the woman pastor in the evenings..... so the Lord surely showed me a definite NO NO.... I am wondering though why He had me go there in the first place? It was probably to get you thinking about the subject. I can see why he led you to visit.
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Post by 4hizglory37 on Oct 15, 2019 1:01:20 GMT -5
The whole reason for me to go visit that church was because this woman (sister in Christ) came to visit me where I serve on Tuesdays (I write for a local paper about our senior center lunch, news, announcements, and tell little snippets of my life on the farm-haha) She said that she had come before wanting to meet me because she knew I was a believer (I write verses at the end of my articles) and when she came I was not there (I almost never ever miss a meal- the one time I miss in the year she came) But she came a couple of weeks ago and we met, we instantly had a connection in our spirits. Like as if we knew each other and the love of Christ in us made us just easily connect. I believe this was a divine appointment. Well, after meeting her and talking, I kept thinking about her and thought, hmm, maybe I should go and visit her church. I asked one of my friends who likes to go around visiting all the churches in the area (she believes that is her ministry) I asked her when this person's church meets. Her eyes got all big and she said that she and the other person were praying that I would come and visit! So I went, not knowing why I was supposed to go there. I still am a little unsure. The new friend and I had been talking and praying early in the morning, I thought, oh why don't we pray together about the spiritual darkness in our county and areas. Well, the next day she said the Lord gave her a warning about a pastor's covering. I was like, what is that? I said my husband is my covering, I know we don't have pastor in our church but we do have elders and since they make the decisions for our church, I am under their covering, and since I am assistant worship leader, I have the worship leaders' covering too. No, she said I needed a pastor's covering. I don't really agree with that because Jesus is my covering too. He is the head of the church. So, I decided to fast and pray about visiting this other church again or going there in the evenings. I wanted to know if the Lord wanted me to go there or not. I was asking Him also if I was to receive a blessing, annointing from this woman pastor? But the Holy Spirit led me to this video and I believe I am maybe to bring to light this error to my friend. I sent her the video in an email. She was not happy about it and didn't want to watch it. I asked her to watch it so that we could have a discussion about it and what she thinks this woman is saying. I am praying that she would at least watch and then take it to the Lord.
That church was great like in the video. They had a woman share her testimony of visiting a prison and ministering to the women and sharing about Jesus and how He has redeemed her. The worship was great, there were spirit filled people genuinely praising the Lord and joy in their singing. I saw people coming an hour and half early before the service to pray. I saw all those good things. But it did not feel right that the pastor was a woman.
Why Lord? Why did you have me go there? It was such a strong nudge to go there. I don't understand it Lord......
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777
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Post by 777 on Oct 15, 2019 6:45:45 GMT -5
Even without seeing the video, I do not believe women are qualified to be Pastors. I believe they can be used by God, but not in that capacity. I will try to find time to check out the message.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Oct 15, 2019 7:23:14 GMT -5
It sounds like your friend thinks a pastor is a dictator/CEO and without that one dynamic person leading a church it will be lacking. Why would it somehow be better to work under the guidance of one strong personality than under a half-dozen collaborative elders? 4hizglory37 don’t give up too quickly on why God may have set this in motion. He often plays chess while we’re playing checkers. He might be wanting to teach you something about Christians who end up in this type of church. Clearly you and this woman attend very different churches, so you have a chance to observe all kinds of things. You can tell her until you’re blue in the face that you don’t trust her pastor, or you can build a case around evidence.
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Post by Giller on Oct 15, 2019 9:42:36 GMT -5
1Ti 2:12 (12) But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
They are to be in silence in regards to being an authority figure in the church, Paul says I suffer not a woman to teach, so they are not to teach a congregation, because simply that is the way God set up things.
And then it goes on to say this:
1Ti 2:13-15 (13) For Adam was first formed, then Eve. (14) And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. (15) Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.
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Post by Giller on Oct 15, 2019 9:50:47 GMT -5
I do not believe this woman should have taken any role in the form of a pastor, the elders should have taken over to preach.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2019 14:25:45 GMT -5
From the scripture I dont' believe women are to teach in the body of Christ in an authoritative capacity. Their role is to be largely a hidden and supportive one under the covering of their husbands. Just as where marriage is a picture of Christ and the church....and the woman symbolically represents the church...and the church is hidden in Christ. I've seen women on you-tube supposedly "teaching" only women....and still I consider that is usurping the role of men, since the women are to be taught by male teachers/preachers, along with everybody. Feel free to help my memory if need be, but I can't think of anything in scripture about women teaching women that way, other than informally to teach the younger how to live right.
Forums are somewhat problematic for women, I think...if you are quiet it's like you are not there at all. And when you try to express your thoughts in writing it can come across as being "teachy" just from limited writing skills and trying to focus on organizing your thoughts coherently. Also married women are usually not on the internet with their husbands, so are not covered by their presence.
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Post by John on Oct 15, 2019 17:08:31 GMT -5
From the scripture I dont' believe women are to teach in the body of Christ in an authoritative capacity. Their role is to be largely a hidden and supportive one under the covering of their husbands. Just as where marriage is a picture of Christ and the church....and the woman symbolically represents the church...and the church is hidden in Christ. I've seen women on you-tube supposedly "teaching" only women....and still I consider that is usurping the role of men, since the women are to be taught by male teachers/preachers, along with everybody. Feel free to help my memory if need be, but I can't think of anything in scripture about women teaching women that way, other than informally to teach the younger how to live right. Forums are somewhat problematic for women, I think...if you are quiet it's like you are not there at all. And when you try to express your thoughts in writing it can come across as being "teachy" just from limited writing skills and trying to focus on organizing your thoughts coherently. Also married women are usually not on the internet with their husbands, so are not covered by their presence. A woman teaching using videos on YouTube is really not doing anything more in the way of teaching than in a forum. I think the issue in the Bible is authority. A woman can't really usurp or take a man's place on YouTube since there is not a finite number of people that can set up an account and post videos there.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2019 17:15:01 GMT -5
The whole reason for me to go visit that church was because this woman (sister in Christ) came to visit me where I serve on Tuesdays (I write for a local paper about our senior center lunch, news, announcements, and tell little snippets of my life on the farm-haha) She said that she had come before wanting to meet me because she knew I was a believer (I write verses at the end of my articles) and when she came I was not there (I almost never ever miss a meal- the one time I miss in the year she came) But she came a couple of weeks ago and we met, we instantly had a connection in our spirits. Like as if we knew each other and the love of Christ in us made us just easily connect. I believe this was a divine appointment. Well, after meeting her and talking, I kept thinking about her and thought, hmm, maybe I should go and visit her church. I asked one of my friends who likes to go around visiting all the churches in the area (she believes that is her ministry) I asked her when this person's church meets. Her eyes got all big and she said that she and the other person were praying that I would come and visit! So I went, not knowing why I was supposed to go there. I still am a little unsure. The new friend and I had been talking and praying early in the morning, I thought, oh why don't we pray together about the spiritual darkness in our county and areas. Well, the next day she said the Lord gave her a warning about a pastor's covering. I was like, what is that? I said my husband is my covering, I know we don't have pastor in our church but we do have elders and since they make the decisions for our church, I am under their covering, and since I am assistant worship leader, I have the worship leaders' covering too. No, she said I needed a pastor's covering. I don't really agree with that because Jesus is my covering too. He is the head of the church. So, I decided to fast and pray about visiting this other church again or going there in the evenings. I wanted to know if the Lord wanted me to go there or not. I was asking Him also if I was to receive a blessing, annointing from this woman pastor? But the Holy Spirit led me to this video and I believe I am maybe to bring to light this error to my friend. I sent her the video in an email. She was not happy about it and didn't want to watch it. I asked her to watch it so that we could have a discussion about it and what she thinks this woman is saying. I am praying that she would at least watch and then take it to the Lord. That church was great like in the video. They had a woman share her testimony of visiting a prison and ministering to the women and sharing about Jesus and how He has redeemed her. The worship was great, there were spirit filled people genuinely praising the Lord and joy in their singing. I saw people coming an hour and half early before the service to pray. I saw all those good things. But it did not feel right that the pastor was a woman. Why Lord? Why did you have me go there? It was such a strong nudge to go there. I don't understand it Lord...... I think there is a red flag in the fact that these two "prayed" for you to visit that church......why would it matter so much to them that they would need to pray for something like that, instead of just inviting you........your life belongs to God and His will, not their will or anyone else's. There is such a thing as witchcraft prayers.......
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2019 17:34:25 GMT -5
From the scripture I dont' believe women are to teach in the body of Christ in an authoritative capacity. Their role is to be largely a hidden and supportive one under the covering of their husbands. Just as where marriage is a picture of Christ and the church....and the woman symbolically represents the church...and the church is hidden in Christ. I've seen women on you-tube supposedly "teaching" only women....and still I consider that is usurping the role of men, since the women are to be taught by male teachers/preachers, along with everybody. Feel free to help my memory if need be, but I can't think of anything in scripture about women teaching women that way, other than informally to teach the younger how to live right. Forums are somewhat problematic for women, I think...if you are quiet it's like you are not there at all. And when you try to express your thoughts in writing it can come across as being "teachy" just from limited writing skills and trying to focus on organizing your thoughts coherently. Also married women are usually not on the internet with their husbands, so are not covered by their presence. A woman teaching using videos on YouTube is really not doing anything more in the way of teaching than in a forum. I think the issue in the Bible is authority. A woman can't really usurp or take a man's place on YouTube since there is not a finite number of people that can set up an account and post videos there.
Well that raises an interesting question....the internet might be regarded as uncharted territory, it's just not the same as being physically present. But off the top of my head I'm leaning to the perspective that the church is the whole entire body of believers worldwide, one church without walls.....so a Christian woman on the internet who calls herself a teacher and teaches women....is part of the church and usurping teaching authority that is only given to men, from how I am understanding this. I used to think that women could teach women (authoritatively), but from watching some on you-tube, it came to me one day that the woman is supposed to learn from the man. We don't exclude women from the preaching and set them under women teachers and preachers in the church....there is just no biblical example or instruction for doing that, that I'm aware of. Women all learn together with the men, from male teachers/preachers. Since Eve was the one deceived...wouldn't that apply just the same whether a woman is trying to teach either men or women?
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Post by John on Oct 15, 2019 17:44:53 GMT -5
A woman teaching using videos on YouTube is really not doing anything more in the way of teaching than in a forum. I think the issue in the Bible is authority. A woman can't really usurp or take a man's place on YouTube since there is not a finite number of people that can set up an account and post videos there.
Well that raises an interesting question....the internet might be regarded as uncharted territory, it's just not the same as being physically present. But off the top of my head I'm leaning to the perspective that the church is the whole entire body of believers worldwide, one church without walls.....so a Christian woman on the internet who calls herself a teacher and teaches women....is part of the church and usurping teaching authority that is only given to men, from how I am understanding this. I used to think that women could teach women (authoritatively), but from watching some on you-tube, it came to me one day that the woman is supposed to learn from the man. We don't exclude women from the preaching and set them under women teachers and preachers in the church....there is just no biblical example or instruction for doing that, that I'm aware of. Women all learn together with the men, from male teachers/preachers. Since Eve was the one deceived...wouldn't that apply just the same whether a woman is trying to teach either men or women? What comes to mind is what it says in Titus 2:1-5 about the aged women teach the younger women about topics that pertain to them.
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