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Post by John on Jan 17, 2020 16:24:25 GMT -5
Carnal mind can't perceive the things of the SPIRIT. People just don't grow very far in the churches....they are in part what Jesus was talking about not hiding the light under a bushel...low ceilings and domed roofs of the institutional churches. Come out of her my people, the scripture says. Time is running out and judgment is beginning with His house. There is a lot of deafness here unfortunately to things that are not complicated. I recall Jesus rebuking folks for being slow and dull of hearing, not to mention those who were misunderstanding and twisting His words and accusing Him falsely. It shouldn't be hard to hear that Jesus was saying the very opposite of the curse in his teaching about the sparrows and lilies, not hard at all if anyone is leaning not on their own understanding. ARISE, shine and Christ will give thee LIGHT. The one who keeps calling others carnal minded and deaf is the one who has the carnal mind and can't hear.
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Post by John on Jan 17, 2020 16:38:56 GMT -5
I read the Abigail story to see what it is about. I don't think it was making a point about wives, but it was telling a story about things that happened. This does cause me to wonder about something. David took Abigail to be his wife, even though he was married to other women at the time. Does that mean God is ok with a man having more than one wife? I almost locked this thread thinking all questions were answered, but I didn't see this. In the law of Moses, polygamy was regulated, but not forbidden. The Bible never addresses polygamy as sin, but we can see from examples where a man had more than one wife at a time, there were problems, usually related to jealousy and insecurity. We also can see from Genesis that God intended marriage to be between one man and one woman. I can't say it is a sin, but anyone that chooses to do that is asking for problems. Also, polygamy is not legal in most countries.
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Post by Rejoice on Jan 17, 2020 22:48:30 GMT -5
I read the Abigail story to see what it is about. I don't think it was making a point about wives, but it was telling a story about things that happened. This does cause me to wonder about something. David took Abigail to be his wife, even though he was married to other women at the time. Does that mean God is ok with a man having more than one wife? I almost locked this thread thinking all questions were answered, but I didn't see this. In the law of Moses, polygamy was regulated, but not forbidden. The Bible never addresses polygamy as sin, but we can see from examples where a man had more than one wife at a time, there were problems, usually related to jealousy and insecurity. We also can see from Genesis that God intended marriage to be between one man and one woman. I can't say it is a sin, but anyone that chooses to do that is asking for problems. Also, polygamy is not legal in most countries.
Thank you.
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Cletus
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Post by Cletus on Jan 18, 2020 7:35:30 GMT -5
so in your response i am not seeing one scripture that shows those who are in the faith are not under the genesis curses.
in your response i see no evidence that women no longer have pain during child birth due to faith.
let me bottom line this for you... in all ways every bit of suffering can be traced back to the original sin in the garden. every disease. and yet christians die of diseases and cancer every day. Christians suffer still. did you know right now in the world there are 39 types of categories of diseases today? did you know that back in Jesus' day it was believed that 40 lashes from the cat-o-nine was sure death and so only 39 lashes were given even when the sentence was 40 lashes? by His stripes we were healed.
I do not desire to debate whether Jesus received 39 or 40 lashes. either way the price was paid. and yet, every day born again believers die of diseases, they get sick, so i am having a real hard time coming to terms with what you are claiming here about believers not being under the curse. it is readily apparent that we are.
its even more bizarre the claim you make when you cant provide even one scripture, or one testimony. it is true you quoted scripture, however, none of the scripture you provided says what you are saying. instead you say it sounds like or you think. ... you think? based on what? I would encourage you to not build a foundation of beliefs on i think. that is grounds for serious error. show me scripture that says genesis curses are null. I have provided scripture that says plainly my position. I have not brought i think to the table. I have brounght scripture and evidence in the physical world that can be observed.
there used to be a man i knew. a Chaplin. whatever that is. some kinda preacher? idk. the flu was going around. he was saying in Jesus name i wont get sick... in Jesus name i stand against catching the flu and i rebuke that evil... blah blah blah. i knew as he was saying all this God was going to show him how the name it and claim it stuff is fake and religious. He said all this in the evening. he called in sick in the morning. he had faith not to get sick... but he still got sick. the bottom line here... what was his faith in... Jesus? or did he have faith that his faith wouldnt let him get sick... like some kind of magical charm. like some kinda talisman. this way of thinking is a form of superstition. its common in the fallen mans mindset. the truth is faith in Jesus is faith in Him. if He allows you to get sick praise God. if He heals you... praise God. but even if you die... praise God... and that is faith IN Jesus, not in my faith wont let me get sick. God is not a God that is above suffering/us suffering. so where then does faith stand?
If you need time to search the scriptures i will be glad to pick up this conversation again with you later.
I really thought you might get it brother. Never mind. I have brought other scriptures as well as even a testimony earlier in the debate about this. It's been a long haul and time to set it aside now. No, I don't believe in name it and claim it Christianity and that is not in any way what I have been trying to say. I'm just done with this subject now....bless you. you have said more than once in this thread you were done with it and you continued to post, even after the above quoted response to me. thus i am responding.
to be fair, i went back and read every one of your posts in this thread. not one of your posts show even one scripture that backs up your claim, nor are there any testimonies given by you that say what you claim.
the reason people are not in agreement with what you say is because scripture does not support your claim. its not found anywhere in scripture. if it was you would be able to provide scripture to show it does. The Spirit and scripture are always in agreement. this is why previously i asked you where did you get this idea. If Scripture does not support it The Spirit is not going to give it either.
Again, no where in this thread have you provided one scripture or one testimony to back up your claim. How convenient it is that when you are unable to provide either you want to bow out of the discussion. This is not the kind of behavior one must display in search of truth. its not how those Brereans did it. what your are displaying here is self justification to continue on in something unsure. I would encourage you to examine your motive and scripture on this. Scripture is truth. if it aint in there it probably aint true.
the claim you make of the genesis curses being long gone already from those who believe is discredited not only from lack of supporting scripture but also by observation in the lives of believers around us. all around us, and in each and every one of us. so please, enlighten the rest of us who according to your claim obviously are of less than little faith... please show us where such great faith as yours can be had. inquiring minds want to know. surely there is more evidence available than "i am done with this topic"
show me one place where thorns and weeds are no more. one place women no longer have pain during labor. one place snakes do not slither on their belly. show me one place where a believer does not die. it seems as if all of the curses are still in effect, none being lifted.
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Post by Trudi on Oct 23, 2020 7:30:28 GMT -5
Nicely put. Regards! Best Essay writing introduction to sociology 3
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Post by watchful on Oct 23, 2020 9:13:42 GMT -5
I really thought you might get it brother. Never mind. I have brought other scriptures as well as even a testimony earlier in the debate about this. It's been a long haul and time to set it aside now. No, I don't believe in name it and claim it Christianity and that is not in any way what I have been trying to say. I'm just done with this subject now....bless you. you have said more than once in this thread you were done with it and you continued to post, even after the above quoted response to me. thus i am responding.
to be fair, i went back and read every one of your posts in this thread. not one of your posts show even one scripture that backs up your claim, nor are there any testimonies given by you that say what you claim.
the reason people are not in agreement with what you say is because scripture does not support your claim. its not found anywhere in scripture. if it was you would be able to provide scripture to show it does. The Spirit and scripture are always in agreement. this is why previously i asked you where did you get this idea. If Scripture does not support it The Spirit is not going to give it either.
Again, no where in this thread have you provided one scripture or one testimony to back up your claim. How convenient it is that when you are unable to provide either you want to bow out of the discussion. This is not the kind of behavior one must display in search of truth. its not how those Brereans did it. what your are displaying here is self justification to continue on in something unsure. I would encourage you to examine your motive and scripture on this. Scripture is truth. if it aint in there it probably aint true.
the claim you make of the genesis curses being long gone already from those who believe is discredited not only from lack of supporting scripture but also by observation in the lives of believers around us. all around us, and in each and every one of us. so please, enlighten the rest of us who according to your claim obviously are of less than little faith... please show us where such great faith as yours can be had. inquiring minds want to know. surely there is more evidence available than "i am done with this topic"
show me one place where thorns and weeds are no more. one place women no longer have pain during labor. one place snakes do not slither on their belly. show me one place where a believer does not die. it seems as if all of the curses are still in effect, none being lifted.
Someone bumped this thread back up so think I'll just come back for a minute, and maybe it will help underline what I was trying to say, now that the dust has settled. Really, how can we not see that Jesus broke the curse....have we not heard that the sick are healed, the blind see, the deaf hear and the dead are raised to life? Well, according to our faith, be it. We are even told not to labour for the bread which perishes but labour for the bread that is eternal. It's the natural woman and man who is under the curse, not the new man/woman who is born of the Spirit and is a new creation in which old things have passed away and all things have become new.
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Cletus
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Post by Cletus on Oct 23, 2020 18:54:37 GMT -5
you have said more than once in this thread you were done with it and you continued to post, even after the above quoted response to me. thus i am responding.
to be fair, i went back and read every one of your posts in this thread. not one of your posts show even one scripture that backs up your claim, nor are there any testimonies given by you that say what you claim.
the reason people are not in agreement with what you say is because scripture does not support your claim. its not found anywhere in scripture. if it was you would be able to provide scripture to show it does. The Spirit and scripture are always in agreement. this is why previously i asked you where did you get this idea. If Scripture does not support it The Spirit is not going to give it either.
Again, no where in this thread have you provided one scripture or one testimony to back up your claim. How convenient it is that when you are unable to provide either you want to bow out of the discussion. This is not the kind of behavior one must display in search of truth. its not how those Brereans did it. what your are displaying here is self justification to continue on in something unsure. I would encourage you to examine your motive and scripture on this. Scripture is truth. if it aint in there it probably aint true.
the claim you make of the genesis curses being long gone already from those who believe is discredited not only from lack of supporting scripture but also by observation in the lives of believers around us. all around us, and in each and every one of us. so please, enlighten the rest of us who according to your claim obviously are of less than little faith... please show us where such great faith as yours can be had. inquiring minds want to know. surely there is more evidence available than "i am done with this topic"
show me one place where thorns and weeds are no more. one place women no longer have pain during labor. one place snakes do not slither on their belly. show me one place where a believer does not die. it seems as if all of the curses are still in effect, none being lifted.
Someone bumped this thread back up so think I'll just come back for a minute, and maybe it will help underline what I was trying to say, now that the dust has settled. Really, how can we not see that Jesus broke the curse....have we not heard that the sick are healed, the blind see, the deaf hear and the dead are raised to life? Well, according to our faith, be it. We are even told not to labour for the bread which perishes but labour for the bread that is eternal. It's the natural woman and man who is under the curse, not the new man/woman who is born of the Spirit and is a new creation in which old things have passed away and all things have become new. how many Christians wear glasses?
how many Christians die?
how many christian women have pain during childbirth?
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Eph 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
plainly, the curse Jesus has lifted up off us is the curse of the law, more specifically the one that kills, the one of sin and death. and yet Christians still die. if we live (zao) unto the Spirit... we are not under the curse of that law. however, the curses put forth in genesis...
Gen 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Gen 3:16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; Gen 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living. Gen 3:21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them. Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
those curses all still stand. i never seen a snake that didnt go slithering upon its belly, never have i seen one walk upright... i see my babies born, and my gal is tough... looked like the worst pain i ever seen her go thru... and she did for a few ticks try to rule over me, but cletus aint having that, so once she got right we met in the middle... and we still return to dust. so in conclusion... no, scripture does not back up your claim. on the day when there will be no more tears... no more locks on doors, no more pain or sorrow... then all that will go away... when Christ returns and rules as KING. to further solidify this by scripture take a look at verse 22 in gen 3... God didnt want us to live forever.
also, if you are going to revisit this, i must reiterate what i said when you quoted me.... where is the scripture? if you want to sway my mind scripture is needed.
God does not always "interfere" or intervene in our affairs we bring about. I know so many Christians done passed from cancer. one thing i really do hate, and i mean hate, is cancer. so many funerals. God dont heal us all even when we ask. why,?? ... beats me. but i dont believe its for lack of faith. i done gave up trying to figure out His mind on things. King can do what ever King wants. Who am i to question The KING? i am just an unprofitable servaNT doing what im supposed to or at least trying to... i am just dust with Gods breath in me. and i have zero doubts what God showed me in ecclesiastics when i called on Him for the first time in sincerity... and thats one day i am going to die. you are going to have a hard time convincing me i am not going to die one day.
If you cant show me with scripture there is really no reason to bring this back up. that is still on the table. I have shown how scripture shows what Jesus did lift, and its common sense whats not lifted off us. where is scripture to back up your claim?
what separates us from God is sin... not the curses that God put on us in genesis. God can do any of those things you said anytime... but its us who waits until He does with each of us... until then the curses in genesis are present.
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Post by watchful on Oct 23, 2020 19:42:19 GMT -5
I gave you scripture....the sick are healed, the dead are raised, etc. Jesus reverses the curses. But it is done to us according to our faith (or lack of it). I wear glasses but only because I haven't exercised faith to receive healing for my eyes, not because I'm still under the curse....I can be healed by the Lord at any time, He has bought my healing, unless He decides I need it as chastisement or thorn in my side like Paul had. All things are put under His feet, but just that we do not yet see this manifested entirely for many reasons.
Okay, see if this helps brother....is Jesus under the curse of the fall? No, He isn't. If we are IN HIM, our life hid in Christ, then how can we be under the curse? We are no longer fallen. The old man is under the curse of the fall not our new man. Believing women are not subject to their husbands because they have to be (due to the nature of well, the cursed fallen nature)....now in Christ our submission is voluntary (like His submission to the Father was/is) because it is seemly and also because as much as flesh still influences us (Eve was the one deceived), we need to be under authority (remember in the kingdom of God, ie, in the spirit, there isn't even either male or female).
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Post by watchful on Oct 24, 2020 7:36:40 GMT -5
Rom 5:14-21 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come. But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many. And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification. For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord. Those scriptures above really should put this to rest. The fact is that we are not walking in all that we potentially could be now, and also will be in the end. First of all there is a need to grow up into the full stature of Christ (who didn't have to die let us remember, but could have called upon the Father to send a legion of angels to deliver Him, except that it was the Father's express will that Jesus should taste death for all of us). How many of us are fully sanctified, perfected and are walking in the full stature of Christ? Scripture says there is a need to grow so obviously there are many believers who are in various stages of growth and have not reached their full potential as heirs of Christ. Secondly, there is also the fact that we have not yet received the 'balance owing' on the down payment of the Holy Spirit guaranteeing what will come, and which will be given out in the end (I believe so that we can join our Lord in fighting the last great battle with Him and through Him.) What we have received so far is only the bride price, the betrothal, which claims us for His own as His legally and morally betrothed, but we have not yet consummated the "marriage" to receive all that we will receive and fully become in the end. As wonderful as what we have received is, we ain't seen nothing yet. Anyway, I hope people will just take some time to meditate and consider these things, I'm not trying to win an argument but just want to show that we are not under the natural fallen paradigm of things as believers. In a natural fallen world, women are by nature dependent on men as per the curse and men by nature as per the curse, being stronger and not cumbered with care of children, rule over their women (apart from the advantages and more options that women have had due to this brief time of modernity and relative peace time), but that's surely not the paradigm we are to live in as new creatures and spiritual men and women in Christ.
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Cletus
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Post by Cletus on Oct 24, 2020 12:02:02 GMT -5
Rom 5:14-21 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come. But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many. And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification. For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord. Those scriptures above really should put this to rest. The fact is that we are not walking in all that we potentially could be now, and also will be in the end. First of all there is a need to grow up into the full stature of Christ (who didn't have to die let us remember, but could have called upon the Father to send a legion of angels to deliver Him, except that it was the Father's express will that Jesus should taste death for all of us). How many of us are fully sanctified, perfected and are walking in the full stature of Christ? Scripture says there is a need to grow so obviously there are many believers who are in various stages of growth and have not reached their full potential as heirs of Christ. Secondly, there is also the fact that we have not yet received the 'balance owing' on the down payment of the Holy Spirit guaranteeing what will come, and which will be given out in the end (I believe so that we can join our Lord in fighting the last great battle with Him and through Him.) What we have received so far is only the bride price, the betrothal, which claims us for His own as His legally and morally betrothed, but we have not yet consummated the "marriage" to receive all that we will receive and fully become in the end. As wonderful as what we have received is, we ain't seen nothing yet. Anyway, I hope people will just take some time to meditate and consider these things, I'm not trying to win an argument but just want to show that we are not under the natural fallen paradigm of things as believers. In a natural fallen world, women are by nature dependent on men as per the curse and men by nature as per the curse, being stronger and not cumbered with care of children, rule over their women (apart from the advantages and more options that women have had due to this brief time of modernity and relative peace time), but that's surely not the paradigm we are to live in as new creatures and spiritual men and women in Christ. the scripture you provided is taliking about justification by Christ. the easiest way to understand that is just-if-i'd-never-sinned. the topic here is not curses of genesis are gone... the topic is being born dead in sin, and the law of sin and death being outdone by the Spiritual law and Christs sacrifice via by grace thru faith. Romans is a hard book to just break into the middle of as the context spreads thru many chapters... look before and after that passage you quoted... he is saying faith is greater than the old ways, Gods grace is bigger, Faith is what justified thru Christ, Dead to sin, and alive to God, and all that stuff. nowhere in the entire bible does it say genesis curses are gone. full stop, whoa down. the passage you quoted actually further backs up my claim. the topic in the passage is sin. tho the curses of genesis may have been put on us because of disobedience.... its not an effect of sin... its directly from the mouth of God. And Jesus died you sin.
Plainly, what you are saying is very close to the teachings found in the faith doctrine. which is a false teaching. which does teach that we can by our faith call down the anointing and speak things into existence. this doctrine uses the same formula as witchcraft... light candles in a circle.... draw energy from a source and make things happen. its the same formula but with a happy Jesus face sticker on it. and this teaching has disappointed many who did desire and seek healing and when their faith "failed" them, they later sought council only to be told your faith isnt great enough. Jesus became sin, who knew no sin... He paid the penalty. He became accursed of God to take away the sin of man. that is the curse scripture speaks on being lifted. nowhere in the bible that i am aware of does it say Genesis curses are gone. nor anywhere does it say Jesus died to take away those curses. Jesus died because of sin and the state sin left man in... separated from God. what your saying is true for sin... but not for genesis curses. they are separate, and they still reign among Spirit filled believers today. those who walk after The Spirit and not after the flesh.... there is no condemnation, the Book says... but it dont say we dont have any of sin's curses or effects in our lives at all. Jesus Christ has not said it is done as of yet. everything is not completed. on that day... then all curses, all effects of any curse against us, on us, anything, will be wiped away. until then, we do die and Enoch was a special case which God decided, women do have birth pangs, thorns and weeds are plentiful, etc.
to be clear, i am not accusing you of promoting the faith doctrine. am not, not, not. I am however trying to illustrate for you the depth of what your saying, where it leads. you said yourself, you wear glasses. I didnt know that about you. but that was the first sentence of my previous post. where do you think that came from? i just pulled it out of thin air? if what you say be true... then show me your works... show me your faith. lets see you come to the place of being healed where your glasses are no longer needed.
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Post by watchful on Oct 24, 2020 14:35:49 GMT -5
Oh my goodness, do you know how many people wear glasses bro? lol.
The wages of sin was/is death...ye shall surely die...the curses that God pronounced were all aspects of death reigning through the natural carnal man/woman ...which the bible says death does not reign any more. Where o death is your sting? Who has the keys of death and hell? What does it mean that all things have been put under the feet of Christ...but just that we do not yet SEE everything put under? I really don't know what more proof anyone could need.
You're demanding something in the bible that spells it out, but you must know that truth is often veiled and hid, as the bible says. Everything is not spelled out and spoon fed to us, not by a long shot. So you just think on it some Cletus. Bless you.
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Cletus
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Post by Cletus on Oct 25, 2020 9:58:41 GMT -5
Oh my goodness, do you know how many people wear glasses bro? lol. The wages of sin was/is death...ye shall surely die...the curses that God pronounced were all aspects of death reigning through the natural carnal man/woman ...which the bible says death does not reign any more. Where o death is your sting? Who has the keys of death and hell? What does it mean that all things have been put under the feet of Christ...but just that we do not yet SEE everything put under? I really don't know what more proof anyone could need. You're demanding something in the bible that spells it out, but you must know that truth is often veiled and hid, as the bible says. Everything is not spelled out and spoon fed to us, not by a long shot. So you just think on it some Cletus. Bless you. lots of people wear glasses... and thats the point.
the genesis curses are not aspects of death reigning. the effect of death reigning was due to eating the fruit God said not to. what you are saying is simply untrue. if it was in the bible veiled, then you should be able to provide proof of it, and so far you have not. but what we can see, is that we still deal with the judgment God put in place to this day. that is all the proof we really need, and so i am not understanding why you dont see it when its right in front of your face and all around you, 360 degrees, as far as the eye can see at any point on the earth.
the whole bringing this thread back is not bringing any fruit, and is beginning to be once again, pointless. therefore, i am going to have to bow out.
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Post by watchful on Oct 25, 2020 12:24:50 GMT -5
Oh my goodness, do you know how many people wear glasses bro? lol. The wages of sin was/is death...ye shall surely die...the curses that God pronounced were all aspects of death reigning through the natural carnal man/woman ...which the bible says death does not reign any more. Where o death is your sting? Who has the keys of death and hell? What does it mean that all things have been put under the feet of Christ...but just that we do not yet SEE everything put under? I really don't know what more proof anyone could need. You're demanding something in the bible that spells it out, but you must know that truth is often veiled and hid, as the bible says. Everything is not spelled out and spoon fed to us, not by a long shot. So you just think on it some Cletus. Bless you. lots of people wear glasses... and thats the point.
the genesis curses are not aspects of death reigning. the effect of death reigning was due to eating the fruit God said not to. what you are saying is simply untrue. if it was in the bible veiled, then you should be able to provide proof of it, and so far you have not. but what we can see, is that we still deal with the judgment God put in place to this day. that is all the proof we really need, and so i am not understanding why you dont see it when its right in front of your face and all around you, 360 degrees, as far as the eye can see at any point on the earth.
the whole bringing this thread back is not bringing any fruit, and is beginning to be once again, pointless. therefore, i am going to have to bow out.
But people get their eyes healed too brother. And the dead can be raised. And we as believers have eternal life....no longer are we under the curse of death, and not a hair of our head will perish. By faith I had no pain when my daughter was born. The earth is still under a curse and the lost who are in it, but not the redeemed children of God, because we have been redeemed. Anyway, yes, enough said, have a blessed day. P.S. Actually I don't know that the ground is still cursed...see Genesis 8:21 where God said He will no longer curse the ground...maybe it was a lot harder to obtain food from the ground prior to the flood than it is now. The rains had been withheld all those prior years...might have been a factor.
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Post by Gilberto on Nov 22, 2020 7:48:23 GMT -5
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Post by Anderson on Nov 22, 2020 11:07:59 GMT -5
Many thanks. Plenty of forum posts!
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