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Post by John on May 16, 2020 16:01:01 GMT -5
Take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man. Luke 21:34-36 When I read this scripture, it is compelling evidence of a pre-tribulation rapture. Those who do not believe in a pre-tribulation rapture do not think this shows anything but that God will allow some to survive the tribulation, but I see it as more than that. It is an actual escape for some, but not everyone that happens to believe in Jesus. There are conditions to escape.
If we want to escape, we must "take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged" with sin and cares of this life. If we do wind up in sin and caught up in cares of this life, that day will come upon us unaware. The rapture will take place, and we will not recognize it. To those who are left behind, the great tribulation will come on all those on the face of the whole earth. That is why we are instructed to watch and pray always that we will be accounted worthy to escape. What are we trying to escape? "All these things that shall come to pass." In escaping, we will "stand before the Son of man." I believe that is where we will be during the great tribulation if we are ready to meet the Lord when he returns. That is how I see it.
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Post by joseph on May 16, 2020 16:05:12 GMT -5
Sorry to say but I do not believe in other thoughts about the rapture, Pretrib-Is for me because to me it plainly tells me so from the bible. Why sorry to say ? Because of doubts you have ? Because no teacher teaches what you think is true ? Or because many teachers teaching what you post have been proven to be apostate, or false teachers ? Your own teacher(s) for example ? Unable to provide Scripture Truth for what you CHOOSE to believe ? (it is a choice, apparently)
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headhurt
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Blessed Hope It is Written It Will Be Done
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Post by headhurt on May 16, 2020 16:10:01 GMT -5
Yes some will survive the tribulation and believe in Christ, but it will not be the church. It will be a rage tag team of believers and jews, because there will be a separation of the goats and the sheep at the end of revelations! its there if you want to read it.
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Post by joseph on May 16, 2020 16:15:00 GMT -5
Yes some will survive the tribulation and believe in Christ, but it will not be the church. It will be a rage tag team of believers and jews, because there will be a separation of the goats and the sheep at the end of revelations! its there if you want to read it. "If you want to read it" ? With no source for this and the below posts ? What is the source of this and other statements you have posted , unproven so far, thus subject to testing to be proven false or proven true, as written. headhurt Avatar May 16, 2020 15:38:55 GMT -5 headhurt said: There are more I can come up with but its the modern scourge of the church does not believe in the Rapture and the bible has something to say about our O so modern church,and so that day come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. headhurt Avatar May 16, 2020 15:34:09 GMT -5 headhurt said: Ephraim 306 AD-373 AD Woe to those who desire to see the day of the Lord!” For all the saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord headhurt Avatar May 16, 2020 15:28:49 GMT -5 headhurt said: Cyprian>200 AD-258 AD “We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible.
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Post by John on May 16, 2020 16:19:23 GMT -5
Sorry to say but I do not believe in other thoughts about the rapture, Pretrib-Is for me because to me it plainly tells me so from the bible. Why sorry to say ? Because of doubts you have ? Because no teacher teaches what you think is true ? Or because many teachers teaching what you post have been proven to be apostate, or false teachers ? Your own teacher(s) for example ? Unable to provide Scripture Truth for what you CHOOSE to believe ? (it is a choice, apparently) Lets not personally attack others.
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Post by John on May 16, 2020 16:20:58 GMT -5
Yes some will survive the tribulation and believe in Christ, but it will not be the church. It will be a rage tag team of believers and jews, because there will be a separation of the goats and the sheep at the end of revelations! its there if you want to read it. Can you back this up using scripture? Can you prove that it will not be the church?
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777
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Post by 777 on May 17, 2020 8:32:46 GMT -5
lot of translations it’s called the falling away or the “apostate Church! He said that the Greek word seemed to also mean “departing” which would be more evidence for the pre – tribulation rapture. I have the Geneva translation and they use “the departing” instead of “the falling away”!As tempting as it is to use the pre-King James understanding of 2 Thes. 2:3, you don’t need it to show that Paul taught the Thessalonians a pre-trib rapture. Paul said that before the Day of the Lord can come, there has to be a falling away and the anti-Christ has to be revealed. Then in verse 7 he said that before the anti- Christ can be revealed the restrainer has to be taken out of the way (literally taken from among). This restrainer is widely accepted to be the Holy Spirit resident in the Church. If so Paul was telling them that the church will have to be gone before the anti-Christ can be revealed. What you said about the restrainer being the church is what I believe too. The church that is faithfully serving the Lord when he returns will be raptured out, and will not see the Anti-Christ revealed.
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777
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Post by 777 on May 17, 2020 8:39:51 GMT -5
lot of translations it’s called the falling away or the “apostate Church! He said that the Greek word seemed to also mean “departing” which would be more evidence for the pre – tribulation rapture. I have the Geneva translation and they use “the departing” instead of “the falling away”! As tempting as it is to use the pre-King James understanding of 2 Thes. 2:3, you don’t need it to show that Paul taught the Thessalonians a pre-trib rapture. Paul said that before the Day of the Lord can come, there has to be a falling away and the anti-Christ has to be revealed. Then in verse 7 he said that before the anti- Christ can be revealed the restrainer has to be taken out of the way (literally taken from among). This restrainer is widely accepted to be the Holy Spirit resident in the Church. If so Paul was telling them that the church will have to be gone before the anti-Christ can be revealed. And yet, many anti-christs, and perhaps the anti-christ, has and was already revealed, contrary to the teachers you listen to. Each section above is subject to testing, and may not be difficult to prove false, altogether.... and/or separately. If the source of what you are "reading" was known better, this could be more clearly observed.... Unless you believe that the things mentioned in Revelation already occurred, meaning the tribulation period itself, I don't know how you can say that the Anti-Christ may have been revealed in the past? The only part of Revelation I see as having happened already is the things spoken to the 7 churches. We certainly have not seen the beast system yet.
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777
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Post by 777 on May 17, 2020 8:46:18 GMT -5
Ephraim 306 AD-373 AD Woe to those who desire to see the day of the Lord!” For all the saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord I don't know about the person you're quoting, but look at Amos 5:18. "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? The day of the LORD is darkness, and not light."
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777
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Post by 777 on May 17, 2020 8:52:45 GMT -5
Cyprian>200 AD-258 AD “We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Are you perhaps a jesuit/ trained by jesuits? The purpose of which is to deceive even the elect if possible ? If not, what then ? I believe this comes across more like an accusation than a question, and is unnecessarily confrontational.
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Post by joseph on May 17, 2020 13:31:12 GMT -5
Are you perhaps a jesuit/ trained by jesuits? The purpose of which is to deceive even the elect if possible ? If not, what then ? I believe this comes across more like an accusation than a question, and is unnecessarily confrontational. Did you read the NT ? (rhetorical)
Of course you did.
HOW did the Apostles, Elders, etc, protect the assembly of Ekklesia, and their own families, and so on, IN LINE WITH YAHWEH'S INSTRUCTIONS ?
Did they let the Galatians false apostles, et al, false angels of light, false gospels, just come right on in and 'share' !?!?
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Post by joseph on May 17, 2020 13:42:42 GMT -5
(or, and before they accepted a "teaching" or a "message" (i.e. a pots) , they TESTED IT.... VERIFIED by SCRIPTURE (famously "Berean") , Verified True, not False. )
No assumption that people are 'good'.
Rather, everything and everyone must be proven, tested, vetted, verified, step by step, as practiced, as written, as directed by the Father in heaven and Always by His Word.
For instance, can anyone point out the part that is truth, and the part that is falseness of this 'message' >> ?
"Observation from a biblical perspective can develop an abundance of spiritual wealth. I’ve found that daily reading of the New Testament starting with the gospels through the epistles develops a knowledge that guarantees when false doctrine is espoused whether by commentary, teaching, or preaching it is easily perceivable."
as frienduff posted once: (subject to Jesus) >> "If we would simply teach and exhort from the bible , the TRUTH would and could be established built upon the heart . It is time and it is high time we let go of some preconcieved ideas and precepts of men . its real simple . start over in JUST the bible and read it for ones self . The Word of GOD is sharp and powerful , it can break a preconcieved idea , acroynm or any mindset that is contrary to GOD , by placing the pure unadulterated truth upon the heart and the mind . If one is a lamb of THE KING , THE SPIRIT would indeed put a love for that which is TRUTH alone , And i promise the bible IS TRUTH . SO all we need to do is Learn JESUS well , and all things inspired by God , all reminders are for our own good . Ready , on the count of three ........one , two , three , OPEN BIBLES and seek ye GOD and feast upon the TRUTH ."
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Post by joseph on May 17, 2020 13:46:48 GMT -5
Ephraim 306 AD-373 AD Woe to those who desire to see the day of the Lord!” For all the saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord I don't know about the person you're quoting, but look at Amos 5:18. "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? The day of the LORD is darkness, and not light."And compare with the Apostles: "MARANANTHA!" Yashua Hamashiach Come Quickly !
and the words of Jesus: "When they all cry out "BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES IN THE NAME ADONAI!" with one heart and one voice", then I WILL COME QUICKLY! (paraphrased)
and "Jesus is returning for those who are EAGERLY WAITING/WATCHING FOR HIM" (NO FEAR at His Coming at all, only GREAT REJOICING ! HEALING ! TRUTH ! JUDGEMENT ! JUSTICE ! FREEDOM ! )
While those of the world, His enemies, fear shadows daily, a thousand or ten thousand fears, and seek to hide under rocks, in caves, at His Return !
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Post by joseph on May 17, 2020 13:47:55 GMT -5
And yet, many anti-christs, and perhaps the anti-christ, has and was already revealed, contrary to the teachers you listen to. Each section above is subject to testing, and may not be difficult to prove false, altogether.... and/or separately. If the source of what you are "reading" was known better, this could be more clearly observed.... Unless you believe that the things mentioned in Revelation already occurred, meaning the tribulation period itself, I don't know how you can say that the Anti-Christ may have been revealed in the past? The only part of Revelation I see as having happened already is the things spoken to the 7 churches. We certainly have not seen the beast system yet. Keep Seeking God's Kingdom, never stop.
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Post by frienduff on May 17, 2020 15:15:02 GMT -5
There are more I can come up with but its the modern scourge of the church does not believe in the Rapture and the bible has something to say about our O so modern church,and so that day come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. I believe in the pre-tribulation rapture, and that Jesus could return today. That being said, making comments like you just did will not help change minds. You gave nobody a reason to believe in the rapture. You just attacked those that do not.
Not only that , but i KNOW and FULLY BELEIVE in the rapture . The man acts like just cause one dont beleive in pre trib means he dont beleive in the rapture . and nothing could be farther from the truth . Something i have learned . TWO things . number one , the LORDS COMING DOES DRAW NIGH , so all must live and be watching and ready , NUMBER TWO , but not matter how long we are in this world , we better also be prepared to lose all , to even die for him . CAUSE the last time i checked , MANY already have . WERE they who died for him during all those times that tribulation spiked up , ANY LESS than us , are we any BETTER than they . NO . AS long as we are in this world , we better know and understand TIMES can get bad and fast and we could even DIE for our refusal to conform to a lie . THE THREAT is no less for us , than it has been for all who already have died and are dying even now for the true faith . WE better know this well . BE LOOKING and be ready , BUT KNOW and understand , TRIBULATION is appointed for all who live godly , and the time of relative peace in the western socities , IS ENDING . Whether we are alive till HIS coming or not . EVERY DAY we in this world , ITS GONNA GET WORSE . EVERY DAY . A TIME IS COMING when all who conformed not to the lie , WILL face total betrayal and many will die . I SIMPLY SAY the WILL OF GOD BE DONE . IF IT IS HIS WILL that i live to HIS COMING AMEN , AND IF IT IS HIS WILL that my head is bashed in for loving JESUS and not a lie , THEN AMEN . EITHER WAY I WIN , EITHER WAY . TO JESUS BE THE GLORY , no matter what comes against me . AND LETthe LORD give me all the strength i need , as i KNOW i can do nothing apart from HIM . I MADE MY DECISION . If i gotta die for JESUS i win , IF I GOTTA SUFFER FOR HIM , I WIN and if i remain TO HIS COMING , I WIN , FOR JESUS HE HAS ALREADY WON .
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