PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Jun 24, 2018 12:45:18 GMT -5
Now anyone can preach the milk. Even deceiving pastors preach the milk wonderfully, convicting many to come to Christ, ....A wonderful preacher does not mean that he is a true servant of the Lord, and the only way to tell if someone is truly in the Lord, is to hear his doctrine when going further than the gospels, ....on what's to come, whether it is the spirit of truth or the spirit of error speaking. This is what I objected to, watchful. I don't believe the only way to tell those truly in the Lord is whether they accurately tell us the future. I rejoice when I hear the gospel preached. I don't hold my judgment until the preacher pleases me with his teaching on Revelation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2018 13:20:32 GMT -5
<< The understanding of and application of correct Christian doctrine that pertains to how we are to live and to be as Christians is what grows Christians to maturity in Christ, not an understanding of eschatology or various mysteries of the Scriptures, which is trivial knowledge by comparison. >>
They can't be trivial by comparison, because it all works hand in hand to grow us up. Without knowing God in Christ, who we are to be like, we wont' grow to be like Him...or we will grow to be like a false Christ if we understand wrongly. All scripture is useful and profitable...including eschatology and prophecy...which teaches us about the Lord and glorifies Him, and is not just for the purpose of knowing the future. I dont' know what mysteries you are talking about in particular, but in general since we serve a God who works in mysterious ways, then its good to learn of His mysteries as well, so that we can be like Him. Though I believe the Lord leads and teaches us all individually, since we have our own individual uniqueness and gifts and callings, etc, and so different people will have their different areas of emphasis, and only in humility can we recognize that and learn from one another.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2018 13:29:40 GMT -5
Now anyone can preach the milk. Even deceiving pastors preach the milk wonderfully, convicting many to come to Christ, ....A wonderful preacher does not mean that he is a true servant of the Lord, and the only way to tell if someone is truly in the Lord, is to hear his doctrine when going further than the gospels, ....on what's to come, whether it is the spirit of truth or the spirit of error speaking. This is what I objected to, watchful . I don't believe the only way to tell those truly in the Lord is whether they accurately tell us the future. I rejoice when I hear the gospel preached. I don't hold my judgment until the preacher pleases me with his teaching on Revelation. I think she made a good point.....nearly all Christians start out believing the basics in common.....but they either mature or start to go astray based on their understanding or misunderstanding of the further things of God. Yes, the spirit of truth or the spirit of error, and that is usually due to the flesh, as always....what is in the heart of the person. Learning what's to come is not about fortune telling, so much as it is about knowing God, learning of His ways and this helping us to become like Him. It's all working hand in hand. Even so, it's always humbling to remember we only know in part for now....but nevertheless we are to keep on until He comes.
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Post by tlsitd on Jun 24, 2018 13:38:10 GMT -5
God gives those who love (obey) Him and are doing His will to the best of the knowledge they have, with a good conscience toward Him, all the grace and understanding they need to do His will and to continue growing in Christ-likeness. Nothing more than that is necessary, whatever else we ourselves may desire to know or to do.
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Post by frienduff on Jun 24, 2018 13:43:23 GMT -5
God gives those who love (obey) Him and are doing His will to the best of the knowledge they have, with a good conscience toward Him, all the grace and understanding they need to do His will and to continue growing in Christ-likeness. Nothing more than that is necessary, whatever else we ourselves may desire to know or to do. DIRE TRUTH SISTER . DIRE TRUTH . the LORD revealed that to me Years ago . We wonder WHY their are so many different views on end times , GO back and see what each one who taught as they did , FIRST DID WITH JESUS and HIS SAYINGS . And everytime I see a warped end time eschatology , I question the one who taught it with JESUS basic sayings . YOU know what . EVERY TIME , EVERY SINGLE TIME they have OMITTED at least two or more of JESUS sayings . SO no wonder they get delusion . ON HIS DAY , he never mentioned one got told I NEVER knew you , cause you did not understand all end time prophecy . NOPE its because they were hearers but NOT DOERS of the WORD. They twisted HIS SAYINGS , HIS WORD and on that day , JUST as JESUS said , MY WORDS will be YOUR JUDGE> YEAH , what you said , IS DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE TRUTH .
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Post by frienduff on Jun 24, 2018 13:44:39 GMT -5
For I tell you all TRUTH . What a man or woman LOVES , is who and what they WILL SIT UNDER . FACT . FACT . FACT .
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Post by tlsitd on Jun 24, 2018 14:22:12 GMT -5
God gives those who love (obey) Him and are doing His will to the best of the knowledge they have, with a good conscience toward Him, all the grace and understanding they need to do His will and to continue growing in Christ-likeness. Nothing more than that is necessary, whatever else we ourselves may desire to know or to do. DIRE TRUTH SISTER . DIRE TRUTH . the LORD revealed that to me Years ago . We wonder WHY their are so many different views on end times , GO back and see what each one who taught as they did , FIRST DID WITH JESUS and HIS SAYINGS . And everytime I see a warped end time eschatology , I question the one who taught it with JESUS basic sayings . YOU know what . EVERY TIME , EVERY SINGLE TIME they have OMITTED at least two or more of JESUS sayings . SO no wonder they get delusion . ON HIS DAY , he never mentioned one got told I NEVER knew you , cause you did not understand all end time prophecy . NOPE its because they were hearers but NOT DOERS of the WORD. They twisted HIS SAYINGS , HIS WORD and on that day , JUST as JESUS said , MY WORDS will be YOUR JUDGE> YEAH , what you said , IS DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE TRUTH .
If our walk is crooked, our understanding will be too. People can try to get around that all they want to, but this truth is still binding on them. God gives the correct and necessary understanding of His word to those who are using what they have already received as He desires them to, with a pure heart. You can study Greek. You can study Hebrew. You can use one translation or five translations. You can study all kinds of books on all kinds of things. You can do whatever you want. But you're still dependent upon God for understanding. The Bible isn't going to give a disobedient Christian understanding God is withholding from him or her. It's better to make obedience our focus and foremost concern rather than knowledge. Necessary knowledge, and wisdom, will follow obedience. (And God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble, including the grace to understand His word.) Look at the various verses in the NT that talk about people being confused about the Scriptures, and see how often sin is involved---whether because the person doesn't know God at all, or because they aren't being obedient to what they have already received or have impure motives or attitudes of the heart. That's really the root of most confusion on the part of Christians as I have seen it. It's not the Bible they're using or the fact that they don't know Greek or Hebrew, it's the fact that there's more going on in that person's life and heart than meets the eye---and God knows what that is. Sure there are new Christians who are just learning the faith and don't yet know their right hand from their left; but most of the people I've interacted with who are confused about doctrine are not new Christians, so there's obviously something more going on there. And the Scriptures give us insight into why that is likely the case. I don't have to know everybody's heart to know how God works with His own, and He is generous in giving understanding and wisdom to those who please Him and seek Him, and withholds the same from those who do not.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Jun 24, 2018 15:08:45 GMT -5
My great ambition is to know what God wants me to know and do what God wants me to do, for my role in this thing called the body. That is enough to keep me busy. I accept that there may be gifts/callings/revelations that are not for me, at least not yet. Much is required of those to whom much is given. Every new gift brings a new dimension of responsibility, and I could spread myself thin (or get in over my head) chasing after a gift I don't need.
Peter didn't take it upon himself to compete with Paul's gentile ministry. Peter knew his personal calling. He did much for the church... but he didn't write like John or Paul, and he didn't try to teach revelation knowledge that Paul received to help the Greeks. Revelation knowledge doesn't come to make us more learned, but to equip us for our destiny, and we often receive revelations to answer specific things in our path. None of the apostles wrote the NT single-handedly. None of them went around saying they could have easily written what the other guy wrote.
We are not interchangeable cogs. We learn deep things about the manifold wisdom of God, in relation to our personal ministry efforts. Life experience, prayer for specific answers, study of specific topics, etc, all converge to reveal to us amazing things in our walk. Then we take that hard-fought revelation and share it with those who don't encounter the same issues, so that they may benefit from our experience.
The hand can't tell the foot to get lost. Eyes can't pretend to be noses. If one person could be an eye and a nose and a foot all at once, then the Bible wouldn't tell us we need each other.
Christians don't advance because it's hard work to get out there and plow a field. It's hard to apply the little we are given in a practical, tangible sense, minding our own business and planting our own crop. It's hard work to disciple our friends into a lifestyle of worship and piety. But those are the trenches that give us rewards of prophesy, miracles, deliverance, and salvations.
I don't judge another person's walk by one or two areas of ministry. I don't assume that any real Christian should know what I know. If I see someone passionately in love with Jesus, devoting themselves to pleasing God and helping their neighbors, I rejoice. That should be enough.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2018 15:26:35 GMT -5
<< He is generous in giving understanding and wisdom to those who please Him and seek Him, and withholds the same from those who do not. >>
Amen.
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Post by tlsitd on Jun 24, 2018 15:36:35 GMT -5
My great ambition is to know what God wants me to know and do what God wants me to do, for my role in this thing called the body. That is enough to keep me busy. I accept that there may be gifts/callings/revelations that are not for me, at least not yet. Much is required of those to whom much is given. Every new gift brings a new dimension of responsibility, and I could spread myself thin (or get in over my head) chasing after a gift I don't need. Peter didn't take it upon himself to compete with Paul's gentile ministry. Peter knew his personal calling. He did much for the church... but he didn't write like John or Paul, and he didn't try to teach revelation knowledge that Paul received to help the Greeks. Revelation knowledge doesn't come to make us more learned, but to equip us for our destiny, and we often receive revelations to answer specific things in our path. None of the apostles wrote the NT single-handedly. None of them went around saying they could have easily written what the other guy wrote. We are not interchangeable cogs. We learn deep things about the manifold wisdom of God, in relation to our personal ministry efforts. Life experience, prayer for specific answers, study of specific topics, etc, all converge to reveal to us amazing things in our walk. Then we take that hard-fought revelation and share it with those who don't encounter the same issues, so that they may benefit from our experience. The hand can't tell the foot to get lost. Eyes can't pretend to be noses. If one person could be an eye and a nose and a foot all at once, then the Bible wouldn't tell us we need each other. Christians don't advance because it's hard work to get out there and plow a field. It's hard to apply the little we are given in a practical, tangible sense, minding our own business and planting our own crop. It's hard work to disciple our friends into a lifestyle of worship and piety. But those are the trenches that give us rewards of prophesy, miracles, deliverance, and salvations. I don't judge another person's walk by one or two areas of ministry. I don't assume that any real Christian should know what I know. If I see someone passionately in love with Jesus, devoting themselves to pleasing God and helping their neighbors, I rejoice. That should be enough. All any of us should desire to be and to do is what God wants us to be and to do. Anything else we might pursue or take it upon ourselves to be will amount to wood, hay and stubble. If we ask Him to help us to know what we need to know and to do whatever we need to do to live pleasing to Him and to do His will, He will give us that. There's nothing more to aspire to be or to do than what God has called us to be and wants us to do personally. We're not going to get any praise or rewards from Jesus on judgment day for anything but having done His will for us faithfully, whatever that may be for each of us. So that's what we should preoccupy ourselves with knowing and doing, and that is what we will be blessed in doing.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Jun 24, 2018 17:07:21 GMT -5
My great ambition is to know what God wants me to know and do what God wants me to do, for my role in this thing called the body. That is enough to keep me busy. "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you." - Matthew 7:7
"...Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full." - John 16:24
"...for the joy of the Lord is your strength." - Nehemiah 8:10I accept that there may be gifts/callings/revelations that are not for me, at least not yet. Much is required of those to whom much is given. Every new gift brings a new dimension of responsibility, and I could spread myself thin (or get in over my head) chasing after a gift I don't need. I still remember when one of my gifts was manifested, that is what I believe what happened...
I was writing and writing, then I was amazed, I thought: Did I write this?! No, it did not come from me... It is not possible.
Yes, it was not from me indeed. Glory to God!
"Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me." - John 15:7
That is when the enemy tries to make you proud, and it is a danger... Gifts definitely have to come when you are ready to receive them.
"But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellence of the power may be of God and not of us." - 2 Corinthians 4:7
And obviously, seek to improve on them... Some gifts may require this.
"Pursue love, and desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy." - 1 Corinthians 14:1
"And to one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one, to each according to his own ability; and immediately he went on a journey." - Matthew 25:15
"But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills." - 1 Corinthians 12:11Eyes can't pretend to be noses. If one person could be an eye and a nose and a foot all at once, then the Bible wouldn't tell us we need each other. Yes, definitely. I believe that the Spirit will reveal to the person what they should be.
As you walk in the Spirit and are given knowledge, and you will know what you should do with what you have received.
I believe the Spirit may also guide the person in knowing what they are capable of doing... As their faith allows.
"But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God." - 1 Corinthians 2:10
"For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God." - 1 Corinthians 2:11
And I am still learning how to walk in the Spirit (and keep walking).
I have learned a few things recently, and it is amazing that when we think we know something...
"And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know." - 1 Corinthians 8:2
Glory to God!
Do not be afraid, we fall, we err, we hit the target, we learn... As long as we keep walking and seek not to repeat our mistakes but rather learn with them.
"Therefore, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God." - 1 Corinthians 10:31
God bless you in Jesus' name!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2018 17:38:59 GMT -5
God gives those who love (obey) Him and are doing His will to the best of the knowledge they have, with a good conscience toward Him, all the grace and understanding they need to do His will and to continue growing in Christ-likeness. Nothing more than that is necessary, whatever else we ourselves may desire to know or to do. Responded to this earlier but it must have got lost in cyber space. Our only desire should be to know the Lord, to worship Him for who He is and to be like Him, and take up His work on earth....yes, by His grace, AND His word AND loving not our lives unto death and the word of our testimony (experience)......all these working together for that end. We do need to know Him through the scriptures, because the bible says we shall be like Him when we see Him as He is....so there is some truth in that we will be like how we believe Him to be....important therefore to seek to know Him as He actually is, and not as He is not.
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Post by Sister on Jun 24, 2018 19:24:57 GMT -5
Now anyone can preach the milk. Even deceiving pastors preach the milk wonderfully, convicting many to come to Christ, ....A wonderful preacher does not mean that he is a true servant of the Lord, and the only way to tell if someone is truly in the Lord, is to hear his doctrine when going further than the gospels, ....on what's to come, whether it is the spirit of truth or the spirit of error speaking. This is what I objected to, watchful . I don't believe the only way to tell those truly in the Lord is whether they accurately tell us the future. I rejoice when I hear the gospel preached. I don't hold my judgment until the preacher pleases me with his teaching on Revelation. Pg Did you soak in that scripture I gave you? that the "testimony of Jesus" is the spirit of prophecy? One gives, one receives. The holy spirit is that telephone line so to speak, so you can hear and understand that spirit speaking which is the spirit of truth which shall show us "all things to come", not just some things , but "all".....the whole lot that has been given in the scriptures from the Word of God.Can you pick a false prophet just from the things they are telling us that we already know to be true?....No. You can't argue with the truth. Can you pick a false prophet from listening further as he goes into his doctrine concerning end time prophecy, death, judgement and the order of events to come....YES, ...if it doesn't align with scripture. If we don't understand prophecy, we can be deceived into accepting everything this prophet proclaims, his whole view. This is how false churches started, bringing in heresies and teaching error, and this is why it is so important to know the prophecies and understand them ourselves personally so that we cannot be deceived and hang on their every word, for they teach the destruction and judgement of others, but in their mind, they are only speaking about those who oppose their teachings, or expose. but don't worry, the world love it's own.
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Post by tlsitd on Jun 24, 2018 19:32:12 GMT -5
I was accused of being a "Catholic basher" and of "sowing seeds of discord" on another Christian forum where I posted the original post, for denouncing heretical distortions of New Testament Christianity. And I named names; I did not spare anyone---not Catholics, not Seventh-Day Adventists, not Messianic Jews.
I'm not sharing this to get sympathy for myself, but I want to encourage all of you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints, AS it was once for all delivered to the saints (which doctrine you can see clearly in the New Testament), because that doctrine is under assault from every side, and anyone who has a back-bone by grace to stand against its dilution and perversion will NOT be a popular person. You'll probably be called names. But you have to set your mind on having the Lord's approval, not people's, or you can't be an effective soldier of Christ.
There is ONE law for ONE people under ONE covenant. (I hope you get this.) You would think that the gospels and the epistles (Romans, Galatians and Hebrews in particular) would be enough to set that straight for Christians, but apparently a whole lot of them have been confused by wrong teaching.
Get back to the New Testament, and re-familiarize yourselves with its teachings, because those teachings are under attack in a major way, and if you're not firmly rooted in the truth, you'll get caught up in and carried away by error of one kind or the other.
A lot of folks here are concerned about Roman Catholicism and its influence on Christianity. I grant you that that's a problem, but the RCC isn't the only organization or religion that is trying to destroy Christianity from its foundations. The many quasi-Christian religions and cults/sects that are teaching various heresies and trying to be accepted as Christian without standing on fundamental Christian doctrine are also chipping away at the foundations, and Christians are either too ignorant of their own doctrine or too afraid of being thought ill of to take a firm stand on those things that the New Testament teaches which conflict with the teachings of such groups as the Messianic Jews or the Seventh Day Adventists.
It's all fine and well to denounce Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons, but somehow when you get around to Hebrew Roots and Messianic Judaism or even Seventh Day Adventism, Christians get very QUIET. We shouldn't be quiet about those things about which the New Testament is LOUD AND CLEAR, brothers and sisters. If God won't tolerate any leaven in His doctrine, His people shouldn't either. If God doesn't accept "almost but not quite", neither should you.
One people of God, consisting of both saved Jews and saved Gentiles. One law (the doctrine of the New Testament) for both Jews and Gentiles. One covenant for Jews and Gentiles. And ALL of these things are in Christ Jesus.
If you don't know, understand or believe this, please re-read the New Testament's teachings on this. The covenants and the promises of God are in Jesus Christ. Outside of Him the only promises of God are wrath and destruction. Unsaved Jews, however religious, are no nearer to God than unsaved non-Jews and need the gospel just as much as Gentiles do. No one comes to the Father except through the Son. Anyone who rejects and does not honor the Son does not have or honor the Father either. God must be worshiped in spirit and in TRUTH.
People will call you hateful or divisive for saying that, but it's the very thing Christianity teaches, and that doctrine is under attack from all sides, to confuse, disarm, and unsettle the saints from their secure position on the foundation of Christian doctrine in any way possible, including using the Bible.
By God's grace I'll never be unsettled; nor will I make any apologies for affirming or defending the teachings of the faith. I hope and pray that you won't either. It is not to men, but to Jesus Christ that we will give an account and whose approval we should be seeking---and whose disapproval we should fear, both for what we say, and for what we choose to keep silent about when we should speak.
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Post by Sister on Jun 24, 2018 19:34:21 GMT -5
God gives those who love (obey) Him and are doing His will to the best of the knowledge they have, with a good conscience toward Him, all the grace and understanding they need to do His will and to continue growing in Christ-likeness. Nothing more than that is necessary, whatever else we ourselves may desire to know or to do. DIRE TRUTH SISTER . DIRE TRUTH . the LORD revealed that to me Years ago . We wonder WHY their are so many different views on end times , GO back and see what each one who taught as they did , FIRST DID WITH JESUS and HIS SAYINGS . And everytime I see a warped end time eschatology , I question the one who taught it with JESUS basic sayings . YOU know what . EVERY TIME , EVERY SINGLE TIME they have OMITTED at least two or more of JESUS sayings . SO no wonder they get delusion . ON HIS DAY , he never mentioned one got told I NEVER knew you , cause you did not understand all end time prophecy . NOPE its because they were hearers but NOT DOERS of the WORD. They twisted HIS SAYINGS , HIS WORD and on that day , JUST as JESUS said , MY WORDS will be YOUR JUDGE> YEAH , what you said , IS DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE DIRE TRUTH .
Frienduff If you see a warped end time eschatology especially on your own forum, you should rebuke openly and give scripture as to why, and not remain silent. The truth should be defended at all costs and the Word of God is our judge on a matter. I think that if we disagree on something someone says, to remain silent and spare their feelings is not putting the truth first. Talking about them, or around them is not how the Lord wants us to deal with each other, but through direct responses to that person having good communication skills to settle a matter. Ie, grab the bull by the horns then and there,...don't shake your head and walk away, but show love by correcting and giving good proof that they are wrong. This is love.
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