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Post by tlsitd on Jul 6, 2018 8:17:18 GMT -5
The Lord laid on my heart this morning how much unrighteous, unnecessary division in His body grieves Him.
Think about how fractured Christianity is today, with denominations and sub-denominations and sects, and even little local churches that have a cult-like spirit and an 'us against the rest of Christianity' mentality. Rather than working to unite in truth and to mend all this division, it seems that there are many who care not at all about the bigger picture of the fractured and compromised state of the body of Christ, but are only concerned with their own little church or denomination or group and their own interests, rather than those of Jesus Christ.
Division continues, like cell division, unprevented and unremedied by the self-centered church, which is more concerned with filling church buildings with unregenerate people for the sake of prestige and money, or with loyalty to parties and having the praise of the same, than it is with making every effort to achieve and to maintain the unity of the Spirit within the universal brotherhood of believers.
Should this be so, brothers and sisters?
We have exhortations and instructions in the New Testament for maintaining the unity of the Spirit, for bearing one another's burdens, for pursuing peace and the edification of one another to build up and strengthen the body of Christ, and these teachings should not be neglected; they are very important to God.
If we want the church to function in the way God intends for it to function, we must follow His instructions and have the mind of Christ about all things.
A house divided against itself cannot stand. Let us ask ourselves what we ourselves are doing to repair the fractures and to achieve the unity of the Spirit that builds up and strengthens the body. It's not heretics and unbelievers we need to be pursuing unity with, but born-again, Bible-believing Christians---unity based on New Testament doctrine and having the mind of Christ, and not on anything else.
But it seems that the backwards, earthly minded church is content to be fractured to smithereens and at war with herself while pursuing the wrong kinds of unity.
Scriptures about unity & division to revisit:
Romans 14; 15:1-6
1 Corinthians 1:10-13
2 Corinthians 12:20
Galatians 5:20
Ephesians 4:1-3
James 3:14-16
Titus 3:9-11
Proverbs 6:16-19
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Post by frienduff on Jul 6, 2018 8:39:13 GMT -5
Thanks for the reminders sister . True unity , the unity that is OF the SPIRIT would have nothing to do with this false unity , which is having all come together , unity for unitys sake . The true unity OF the SPIRIT , that unity is based on unity with THE TRUTH and those OF the TRUTH . You loved sister lights .
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Post by John on Jul 6, 2018 16:21:22 GMT -5
Jesus made it very clear that a divided Kingdom or a divided house cannot stand. Very good reminders.
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Post by ladypeartree on Jul 7, 2018 3:24:47 GMT -5
Unfortunately the enemy is often to be found working within the church and I for one cannot unite with a "church" or group purporting to be such that teaches blatant lies So many try to be "politically correct " and preach inclusion of everything including same sex marriage ( if people of the same sex want to live together in the biblical sense that is their choice but in no way can it be a marriage sanctioned in a God following church ) This month alone there will be a huge meeting whereby a strong and prominent part of the church of England are demanding such things along with a lot of other pro inclusive( anti word of God ) changes to the canon law
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Post by frienduff on Jul 7, 2018 9:04:24 GMT -5
Unfortunately the enemy is often to be found working within the church and I for one cannot unite with a "church" or group purporting to be such that teaches blatant lies So many try to be "politically correct " and preach inclusion of everything including same sex marriage ( if people of the same sex want to live together in the biblical sense that is their choice but in no way can it be a marriage sanctioned in a God following church ) This month alone there will be a huge meeting whereby a strong and prominent part of the church of England are demanding such things along with a lot of other pro inclusive( anti word of God ) changes to the canon law This month there will be a huge meeting whereby a strong a prominent part of the church of England are demanding such things . Lady pear tree, things like this are going on world wide more and more . IF the so called churches are part of the all inclusive movement as are even other religions, IN TIME where do you THINK this leads . AND WHO do you think it leads too .
IF the religions of the world are now more and more as well as the so called faiths even in christanity , starting to unite more and more under this . As it gets worse and worse . WHO do we think it will lead them too . I mean is it not being done under the guise of world peace and unity . KEY WORD , WORLD as in WHOLE WORLD. WHO and where will it lead them to. I TELL and WARN US ALL, RIGHT to the beast the whole world will unite under the banner of the all inclusive spirit of anti Christ which is leading and guiding them RIGHT to the man of sin when he does stand . I mean the world is flowing into this all inclusive more and more , so are the religions . SO nigh the end , WHO YOU THINK the whole world will see as enemy number ONE . THOSE WHO DID NOT GO UNDER THIS SPELL . AKA, THAT IS HOW the great tribulation WILL BEGIN . and sister , we are running out of time . LOOK at how wicked things have got and in just such a short generation . Like its sped up and is speeding up . Churches , mind you , SO called churches uniting under a false love , a false unity , a false mindset a false way of many ways . THIS IS LEADING THEM to the beast . And as the people more and more seek to humanity to save , and deny THE ONLY KING WHO DOES SAVE, THEY WILL GET their hearts desire under the greatest delusion . FOR THEY will reicieve a king , a king who is seen by them as LIGHT , YET HE IS DARKNESS a KING who to them will hold all the answers to the world ills, YET holds only the knowledge of death . IT IS RISING , IT WILL SPRING FORTH suddenly when ONCE the delusion of the all inclusion has taken all who were given to it . OUR BETRAYER and betrayers will then stand as ONE and the war against the saints of the final HOUR will then begin . NOTHING can stop this . IT WAS FORETOLD long ago. I ONLY remind us its on the rise and as the world is being made ready , so too are the people . And now a word . AND GOD SHALL SEND THEM STRONG DELUSOIN to believe a lie , THOSE who rejected the LOVE of truth and wanted and had pleasure IN UNRIGIHTEOUSNESS. ITS AT THE DOOR . A great evil is rising , even now these spirits work as one to cause all that is necessary to get the world as one to come against the true lambs in a one hour end time event . Let us have no fear . LET us honor the ONE WHO SAVED us and can keep us from falling . LET US BE FAITHFUL unto the LAMB and FOLLOW HIM unto the end . You all are loved , let us not fear man nor what he can do unto us . Fear GOD , HONOR HIM in and by the SON . And conform not to this world .
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Post by tlsitd on Jul 18, 2018 20:46:23 GMT -5
There is so much division in the body of Christ because there is so little discernment, too little wisdom, too little Spirit-taught knowledge, and too little love---and everyone seeks his own interests and way and is loyal to his own little group, rather than seeking the interests of Christ, with His attitudes, and being loyal to His doctrine only and devoted to doing His will above all.
Most of the unity in Christianity today is the wrong kind of unity, based on things OTHER than Scriptural truth and the desires of the Holy Spirit: Modern-day Pharisaism of various kinds on the one hand, with its devotion to traditions or beliefs that aren't founded on Scriptural truth or God's will, and to pastors (or rabbis) and church groups, rather than to Jesus Christ; and on the other hand, the Christians who want to unite with heretics and unbelievers for whatever reason (certainly not because it's God's will).
This is not the way God intended for the church to be; but it is the way the demons desire it to be. And because Christians have poor discernment, lack knowledge and correct understanding of God's word, and are ignorant of or indifferent to the will of God, and are serving the desires of the sinful nature and not those of the Holy Spirit, the body has been divided into a thousand pieces, and keeps dividing into more and smaller pieces. Yet the divided pieces are not healthy but diseased; and the divided pieces divide again and produce more diseased pieces.
(Look at the fruit of all of these little Christian groups. Is it good? Or is it blighted by pride, self-righteousness, uncleanness and heresy? What is truly of God produces the fruit that God desires. What is not does not---religious appearances regardless.)
To the divisive (who are actually in Christ---which many are not) I wish that I could say:
Stop dividing the body of Christ unnecessarily and contrary to His will, and being proud of and devoted to your "special" little groups, rather than to Jesus Christ. Stop following the desires of the sinful nature and the persuasions of religious demons and start pursuing those of the Spirit.
May Jesus bring you to your senses and help you to see clearly, and give you His mind and His heart, and the clearer understanding of His will, so that you may no longer be manipulated by the enemy into breaking down and weakening His body, rather than building it up and strengthening it for its God-intended purposes.
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Post by John on Jul 18, 2018 21:34:23 GMT -5
When I was at another Christian message board, I saw major divisions. There was a little clique that had all the favor, and anyone that would get in the way of their doctrine, true or false, was branded a heretic and destroyed. The people in the clique were very much like the Pharisees of Jesus' day, and the people they were trying to destroy were sincere believers. The sincere Christians were not perfect in all of their doctrinal views, but you could see they loved the Lord, and were seeking to understand his truth and share what they learned.
When the idea for this new message board was presented to me, the one thing I did was seek out those sincere Christians and invited them here. My desire was that they be free from people like they had encountered at the other message board. I realized that their beliefs didn't always agree with mine, but no two thinking people will agree on all points, so my primary concern was that they had their trust in Christ, and were genuine. I think that describes most of the people here at Narrow Way. Where I see divisions, it seems to be centered around some who want everything to be done their way. If you don't believe as they do, they want to run you out or shut you up, much as was happening at the other message board. It is almost like they forgot what it was like to be on the receiving end of that kind of treatment.
If you want unity here, it is not that hard to find. You have lots of pasture to graze in, and very few restrictions. If you wander into a section where you feel the grass is bad, go somewhere else and graze. If I have a problem with the doctrine someone else is promoting, and it is so bad that I can't be at peace with them, my best course of action is to stop reading their posts. There is so much to read now, I spend hours catching up. It is hard to read everything. That is a good thing, and I hope the Lord will send even more sincere Christians that will be active. But I can say that there is not a single soul here that in my way of thinking is a heretic or false teacher.
Now, by false teacher, I don't mean 100 percent without error. That is not possible. If that is the standard, we are all false teachers, but I mean people that are promoting things that will lead the reader down the broad road and into hell. The differences are not over essentials to the faith. So my feeling is that we can have unity if we want it, or we can decide that unless others believe as we do, we shall have no unity, stir up strife ourselves, and create a bad atmosphere. I don't particularly want to see that happen. I love the freedom we have, and frankly don't understand those who would prefer an iron fisted approach to things. That is going on right now at WCF. If that is what some desire, that place is perfect for you, but you will have to come in line with the leadership there. They don't go for gifts of the Spirit, words of prophecy, anyone that doesn't believe in OSAS or those who are not 100 percent pro-Israel. You can get away with some of that for a time, but you are on a short leash. I promise you that if everyone here had to abide by only my beliefs, you would not enjoy your time here, anymore than I would want to have to believe exactly as others do.
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Post by tlsitd on Jul 18, 2018 22:37:11 GMT -5
When I was at another Christian message board, I saw major divisions. There was a little clique that had all the favor, and anyone that would get in the way of their doctrine, true or false, was branded a heretic and destroyed. The people in the clique were very much like the Pharisees of Jesus' day, and the people they were trying to destroy were sincere believers. The sincere Christians were not perfect in all of their doctrinal views, but you could see they loved the Lord, and were seeking to understand his truth and share what they learned.
When the idea for this new message board was presented to me, the one thing I did was seek out those sincere Christians and invited them here. My desire was that they be free from people like they had encountered at the other message board. I realized that their beliefs didn't always agree with mine, but no two thinking people will agree on all points, so my primary concern was that they had their trust in Christ, and were genuine. I think that describes most of the people here at Narrow Way. Where I see divisions, it seems to be centered around some who want everything to be done their way. If you don't believe as they do, they want to run you out or shut you up, much as was happening at the other message board. It is almost like they forgot what it was like to be on the receiving end of that kind of treatment.
If you want unity here, it is not that hard to find. You have lots of pasture to graze in, and very few restrictions. If you wander into a section where you feel the grass is bad, go somewhere else and graze. If I have a problem with the doctrine someone else is promoting, and it is so bad that I can't be at peace with them, my best course of action is to stop reading their posts. There is so much to read now, I spend hours catching up. It is hard to read everything. That is a good thing, and I hope the Lord will send even more sincere Christians that will be active. But I can say that there is not a single soul here that in my way of thinking is a heretic or false teacher.
Now, by false teacher, I don't mean 100 percent without error. That is not possible. If that is the standard, we are all false teachers, but I mean people that are promoting things that will lead the reader down the broad road and into hell. The differences are not over essentials to the faith. So my feeling is that we can have unity if we want it, or we can decide that unless others believe as we do, we shall have no unity, stir up strife ourselves, and create a bad atmosphere. I don't particularly want to see that happen. I love the freedom we have, and frankly don't understand those who would prefer an iron fisted approach to things. That is going on right now at WCF. If that is what some desire, that place is perfect for you, but you will have to come in line with the leadership there. They don't go for gifts of the Spirit, words of prophecy, anyone that doesn't believe in OSAS or those who are not 100 percent pro-Israel. You can get away with some of that for a time, but you are on a short leash. I promise you that if everyone here had to abide by only my beliefs, you would not enjoy your time here, anymore than I would want to have to believe exactly as others do.
I definitely would not want this forum to become another WCF. This is a very good forum, in my opinion, and hopefully will become even better with the guidance of the Lord's wisdom and His bringing sincere believers here. My post was something of a rant of frustration over division in the body of Christ in general, not directed at this forum. Part of Godly wisdom is knowing when to agree to disagree, being peaceable enough to do so, and knowing what is important to God and discerning what His will is with regard to putting one's foot down or insisting on a thing. No two Christians are likely to agree on everything, for a variety of reasons, but all should have the goal of being united with one another in God's truth, with God's love, and for God's purposes. Keeping the attitudes and desires of the Holy Spirit at heart---not making provision for those of the sinful nature---and discerning the will of God, would go a long way in creating harmony and unity, even between Christians who don't see eye to eye on everything. Since God Himself desires unity and peace among the saints, rather than division (righteous unity of course), following His lead is the best way to achieve and maintain both.
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Post by John on Jul 19, 2018 4:59:56 GMT -5
"And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand." Matthew 12:25
According to Jesus, division is a sure way to destroy a kingdom, a city and a house. Internal conflicts do far more damage than problems on the outside. What we should be united on is our faith in Christ, and desire to serve him in Spirit and in truth to the best of our ability. That is not absolute agreement on everything, but sincere desire to seek out the truth, while placing our full confidence in Jesus Christ as the only way to the Father and the only way of salvation.
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Cletus
Senior Member
Posts: 2,517
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Post by Cletus on Jul 19, 2018 5:45:44 GMT -5
this forum was a breath of fresh air for me. a sanctuary to regain some sanity. I felt like i was being drawn into some of the negativity at wcf. i was becoming offended in things that didnt really matter. i even have spoken well, written, things i should not have. I have started using the block feature more there. if people want to call others names and be negative and offensive and self righteous, i block them. I would have blocked a couple more if it would let me. but it wont allow you to block some people. And it seems certain people over there can get away with speaking in a way that is not very nice. some people just think they know everything, which is why i wont go in the chat room there anymore. I have decided that I am going to speak the truth and dont really care about people accepting me or not. because i do not represent myself, i represent what God has revealed to me. The Truth, T in Truth being capitalized because its a pronoun. Whats interesting to me is i have noticed a post by a hardcore osas person over there that stated someone else could loose it all. so deep down they dont believe osas. i guess its just a comfort zone thing. oh well, Praise God for his goodness and love!
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Post by John on Jul 19, 2018 6:43:37 GMT -5
I used the block feature once over there during a time I was being harassed, partially over a misunderstanding. Once the issue was resolved, I unblocked that person. I didn't know there were some you can't block. That is crazy!
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PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
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Post by PG4Him on Jul 19, 2018 7:28:54 GMT -5
This is a great thread. Unfortunately, all across our society these days, disposable friendship seems to be the norm. We walk away from marriages, jobs, community projects, you name it. It comes from us caring about our personal benefit more than we care about the cause. If the cause comes first, you overlook yourself. If you come first, you overlook the cause.
As far as I'm concerned, every issue/disagreement must be weighed against the import of unity. Jesus put unity pretty high up on the list in His kingdom, and the apostles left some fairly open-ended questions in their epistles. If they didn't make something a deal breaker, we shouldn't either. Submitting all things under Christ also means submitting to unity.
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Post by tlsitd on Jul 19, 2018 7:30:21 GMT -5
this forum was a breath of fresh air for me. a sanctuary to regain some sanity. I felt like i was being drawn into some of the negativity at wcf. i was becoming offended in things that didnt really matter. i even have spoken well, written, things i should not have. I have started using the block feature more there. if people want to call others names and be negative and offensive and self righteous, i block them. I would have blocked a couple more if it would let me. but it wont allow you to block some people. And it seems certain people over there can get away with speaking in a way that is not very nice. some people just think they know everything, which is why i wont go in the chat room there anymore. I have decided that I am going to speak the truth and dont really care about people accepting me or not. because i do not represent myself, i represent what God has revealed to me. The Truth, T in Truth being capitalized because its a pronoun. Whats interesting to me is i have noticed a post by a hardcore osas person over there that stated someone else could loose it all. so deep down they dont believe osas. i guess its just a comfort zone thing. oh well, Praise God for his goodness and love! It's unfortunate that Christian forums tend to be places for strife and vain, intellectual brain-jousting between scholarly persons rather than of spiritual edification and encouragement. Too many Christians are self-focused rather than Christ-focused, and are serving the desires of their sinful nature under and through their religion rather than those of the Spirit of God, whether they realize it or not. That's something He has to open their eyes to see: It is a matter of spiritual maturity and discernment. Religion, and even the Bible, can become stumbling blocks when Jesus isn't leading one. I felt a strong, hostile, demonic presence at WCF, and participating there made me feel spiritually vexed and weary, not refreshed. (Another Christian forum was even worse: The un-Christlike attitudes there were repulsive. Of course, not everyone who professes to be a Christian really is, and that's the case on Christian forums too.) When a Christian is proud, self-focused, and self-serving, demons can work through him or her to divide, distract, deceive and destroy. We all need to consider why we say what we say, and promote what we promote, and whose interests we're seeking by it, mindful of God's word and the promptings and convictions of His Spirit in our interactions with our brothers and sisters in Christ.
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Post by tlsitd on Jul 19, 2018 7:36:40 GMT -5
If the cause comes first, you overlook yourself. If you come first, you overlook the cause. As far as I'm concerned, every issue/disagreement must be weighed against the import of unity. Jesus put unity pretty high up on the list in His kingdom, and the apostles left some fairly open-ended questions in their epistles. If they didn't make something a deal breaker, we shouldn't either. Submitting all things under Christ also means submitting to unity. Amen to this.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Jul 19, 2018 7:44:03 GMT -5
I felt a strong, hostile demonic presence at WCF, and participating there made me feel spiritually vexed and weary, not refreshed. (Another Christian forum was even worse: The un-Christlike attitudes there were repulsive. Of course, not everyone who professes to be a Christian really is, and that's the case on Christian forums too.) Yes, discussion there is very hard... Definitely has to be on the grace for it, and very well established in the truth.
After my posts had to pass approval of the moderation as they claim I was posting doctrinal content... And that wasn't allowed on the forums.
Well, it is very strange... I cannot post doctrinal truth or opinion in a Christian forum.
I did not find such a problem here at narrow-way. Fortunately, we have far more liberty here.
God bless you all in Jesus' name!
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