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Post by 2fw8212a on Nov 29, 2018 7:26:25 GMT -5
The new translations are completely changing things in the Bible... I do not recommend most newer translations as well. I believe they are unnecessary.
Usually, they come with a lot promises such as: easier to read, easier to understand, new standard (all is using) and the like.
The problem is that people cannot understand the Bible because it is easier to read or understand.
Because trust and understanding of the Bible is both given by God, one cannot even believe what is written without God, let alone to understand it.
Then, I believe an accurate Bible alone is not what determines what will make the person to believe and be saved.
People can read one of the most accurate Bible there is in the world, such as the KJV, but if God does not give them understanding they will never know the truth.
Then, before exalting the KJV I would exalt God first and give Him glory.
Because I know that people could read the KJV and yet be left in deception and devoid of truth.
On the other hand, I believe it is possible someone to read another Bible, such as the NKJV, NASB, ESV and still know the truth and be saved.
I believe they contain enough information for people to know the truth. Even though they are not identical to the KJV.
It is not the KJV or any particular translation that saves and gives understanding of truth, it is God.
"For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen." - Romans 11:36
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Post by John on Nov 29, 2018 9:15:29 GMT -5
The new translations are completely changing things in the Bible... I do not recommend most newer translations as well. I believe they are unnecessary.
Usually, they come with a lot promises such as: easier to read, easier to understand, new standard (all is using) and the like.
The problem is that people cannot understand the Bible because it is easier to read or understand.
Because trust and understanding of the Bible is both given by God, one cannot even believe what is written without God, let alone to understand it.
Then, I believe an accurate Bible alone is not what determines what will make the person to believe and be saved.
People can read one of the most accurate Bible there is in the world, such as the KJV, but if God does not give them understanding they will never know the truth.
Then, before exalting the KJV I would exalt God first and give Him glory.
Because I know that people could read the KJV and yet be left in deception and devoid of truth.
On the other hand, I believe it is possible someone to read another Bible, such as the NKJV, NASB, ESV and still know the truth and be saved.
I believe they contain enough information for people to know the truth. Even though they are not identical to the KJV.
It is not the KJV or any particular translation that saves and gives understanding of truth, it is God.
"For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen." - Romans 11:36 Like Candance, I want a fully accurate Bible for myself. I care about having the absolute truth, but I do not believe we are saved or lost based on the Bible translation we have. You can witness to someone about the plan of salvation and not even have a Bible in your hand when you do, and if they believe and accept Christ, they will be saved.
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PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
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Post by PG4Him on Nov 29, 2018 9:33:05 GMT -5
People are free to read whatever Bible they wish. I’ve never said anyone is a lesser Christian because of a Bible translation. I have my personal conviction about my Bible, and I would appreciate having the liberty to speak my own thoughts.
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Post by frienduff on Nov 29, 2018 10:55:39 GMT -5
Yes. It is a great pity that of all the conspiracies and fear mongering, the Christians seem to lead the pack. The newest Christians must be bombarded with this dichotomous set of ever deepening questions.
I guess we have wavered from the path of, 'I will just preach Christ crucified...'
“Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel… so that the cross of Christ would not be made void.”
YEAH , THIS IS EXACTLY THE PROBLEM . We got folks entertaining all kinds of theories , so no marvel when they entertain this too . WE NEED to GET back to JESUS ONLY preaching and reminders . Stead of fighting over if the earth is a triangle , round or square , or all these conspiracies , GET THE PEOPLE FED UP ON CHRIST IN SOUND DOCTRINE . I see folks striving over all kinds of theories , ufo, the gap theory , now the mandela effect . WE MUST go back to bible teaching and get fattend up on it . If we keep entertaining theories , folks wont get built up , WHO NEED to get built up . It seems every time I turn around some new teaching or even older theory , just keeps getting brought in . ITS time for bible only . And if we know anyone who is agreeing with this mandela effect , WE GOTTA get them to cease it . OR we gonna lose them too . WE WILL LOSE THEM TOO . WE WILL LOSE THEM TOO . As much as I enjoy that most of us get along we cannot get along just to get along if these things are being brought in. I truly wish more people would rise up and start bringing the sayings of Christ and of the apostels back in . I don't know if folks understand this or not , but satan does all to get our mind into thought realm and out of sound doctrine where he can then END US . yeah I said END US . WE got to now make the all out effort to bring back IN the BIBLE only and get folks built up in that . Most folks can quoate who is behind what theory , they can give twenty pages of all this info , BUT hardly know how to even stand on SCRIPTURE on CHRIST ONLY>
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Post by frienduff on Nov 29, 2018 11:05:10 GMT -5
People are free to read whatever Bible they wish. I’ve never said anyone is a lesser Christian because of a Bible translation. I have my personal conviction about my Bible, and I would appreciate having the liberty to speak my own thoughts. You loved sister . Our sister Candace gave us all the democracy approach . And we love her . But I think its time for this approach , We aint in a democracy , WE IN GODS KINGDOM where HE ALONE has determined what we ought to do or not to do and does so for our own welfare and HIS GLORY . So , I say , DO NOT READ some of the newer translations . For sure cease from those who have omitted things and make claims like they were never in the original canon. FLEE those . IF you average men , like me , butero or Cletus , who are not the geniuses of the world , CAN UNDERSTAND the KJV , then anyone can . And ps , I was not always just a plain simple man , I was book wise learned , OH BUT WHAT A FOOL I was suppressed in all the wisdom of the world , seeming as a king yet in total darkness and knowing nothing .
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Post by frienduff on Nov 29, 2018 11:08:25 GMT -5
The new translations are completely changing things in the Bible... I do not recommend most newer translations as well. I believe they are unnecessary.
Usually, they come with a lot promises such as: easier to read, easier to understand, new standard (all is using) and the like.
The problem is that people cannot understand the Bible because it is easier to read or understand.
Because trust and understanding of the Bible is both given by God, one cannot even believe what is written without God, let alone to understand it.
Then, I believe an accurate Bible alone is not what determines what will make the person to believe and be saved.
People can read one of the most accurate Bible there is in the world, such as the KJV, but if God does not give them understanding they will never know the truth.
Then, before exalting the KJV I would exalt God first and give Him glory.
Because I know that people could read the KJV and yet be left in deception and devoid of truth.
On the other hand, I believe it is possible someone to read another Bible, such as the NKJV, NASB, ESV and still know the truth and be saved.
I believe they contain enough information for people to know the truth. Even though they are not identical to the KJV.
It is not the KJV or any particular translation that saves and gives understanding of truth, it is God.
"For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen." - Romans 11:36This is a war , we do not need . Letters , instead sound out the pure exhortations and flood the place with sound doctrine . What we need is that back and this theory stuff gone . Theories and debates lead to only more and worse theory and debates . BUT THE PURE BIBLCAL SOUND DOCTRINE and REMINDERS lead to edification of the people .
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Post by frienduff on Nov 29, 2018 11:12:38 GMT -5
We are fighting a war on many fronts now . The enemy and his children are doing all now in this final hour to lead everything away FROM GOD . And if we have NO FOUNDATION to stand on , if we aint built up IN CHRIST and sound doctrine , not only can we help none , the flood will bust down everything . We have to see this as a all out war . BECAUSE IT IS . And the enemy does not slumber, he is not at rest , he is in full out destructive mode to captive captive any man he can . I nearly fell back when I peeked at that mandela effect . Just another road in to the broad road is all that is . SATAN is behind this concept . I GAURANTEE he is . WHO ELSE would want us to doubt in the bible . NOT GOD . NO , satan would do that .
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Post by frienduff on Nov 29, 2018 11:17:27 GMT -5
ARISE my friends of the LORD . WE must do all now and more than ever to POINT ONLY TO JESUS , to teach ONLY SOUND DOCTRINE . Something dire wicked has began to increase and it will mushroom into a flood of all out evil and just fill every place it can . It does not make me sad to think in time I might die for the LORD . Nor sad for the faithful . What makes my heart heavy and sad , is to even ponder the loss of one lamb to this deception . To me that is so heavy and sad , because all I ever wanted was what was best for the people . AND THAT IS JESUS and sound doctrine to build them up . To me it would be horribly sad to watch even one lamb from this site too stumble and be lost . I don't want anyone to go down the wrong road . ITS WHY WE MUST more than ever , SOUND OUT PURE EXHORTATIONS AGAIN and stop entertaining all these theories .
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Post by Abdicate on Dec 2, 2018 15:34:54 GMT -5
Ahhhh... now I see why my "it's not in the bible" landed like a lead balloon.
Some history about me. After graduating high school, I moved to Pensacola, FL, to attend the bible college there. I discovered that they didn't believe the KJV was the only source of the bible. I'd always listened to and read Peter Ruckman's information, and while in Pensacola, attended his church. He even signed my bible.
Since then, I've learned many computer languages, Spanish (Castilian), Italian (conversational), some Biblical Greek and a lot of Biblical Hebrew (reading). My point is that without the Author, no translation, not even the originals can be understood by the reader. ALL translations have issue, bar none. Why? Because translating introduces a bias.
26 of the 27 times πάσχα is translated Passover, except in Acts 12:4. Why? The KJV translated it Easter. I've already shown what they did to Sabbath. The point is, keep with the Holy Spirit, not a version, and you have the Author's intent as well as the word of God is written in our hearts, Romans 2:15 - scientifically literally. But that's another thread. The written word is not God, but it powerful enough despite men's interference to get His point across. Only the Word of God is God, not the written word. How do I know this? God does not change, James 1:17, and men cannot change God, but they can change (and have) His written word. Just my experience.
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Post by John on Dec 3, 2018 8:05:31 GMT -5
Ahhhh... now I see why my "it's not in the bible" landed like a lead balloon. Some history about me. After graduating high school, I moved to Pensacola, FL, to attend the bible college there. I discovered that they didn't believe the KJV was the only source of the bible. I'd always listened to and read Peter Ruckman's information, and while in Pensacola, attended his church. He even signed my bible. Since then, I've learned many computer languages, Spanish (Castilian), Italian (conversational), some Biblical Greek and a lot of Biblical Hebrew (reading). My point is that without the Author, no translation, not even the originals can be understood by the reader. ALL translations have issue, bar none. Why? Because translating introduces a bias.
26 of the 27 times πάσχα is translated Passover, except in Acts 12:4. Why? The KJV translated it Easter. I've already shown what they did to Sabbath. The point is, keep with the Holy Spirit, not a version, and you have the Author's intent as well as the word of God is written in our hearts, Romans 2:15 - scientifically literally. But that's another thread. The written word is not God, but it powerful enough despite men's interference to get His point across. Only the Word of God is God, not the written word. How do I know this? God does not change, James 1:17, and men cannot change God, but they can change (and have) His written word. Just my experience.
There is no reason to assume Easter is incorrect. The celebration of Easter was known to the people at the time, and the calendar date of Easter varies from year to year. I have never accepted that as being in error. As for the Sabbath, I don't know of any controversies there regarding translation.
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Post by frienduff on Dec 3, 2018 9:48:57 GMT -5
My point is that without the Author, no translation, not even the originals can be understood by the reader. ALL translations have issue, bar none. Why? Because translating introduces a bias.
AND my point is that with the AUTHOR of our faith , we surely can understand the kjv bible . FOR who inspired it . GOD DID . Many will teach us today , that we cannot understand what the apostles wrote and thus they try and show us through a man created and learned process HOW to understand the bible . They will be heavy on hermeuntics and such tatics . They are very world wise . But let a simple babe remind us , GOD ALONE INSPIRED THOSE MEN on how to live , teach and write . KNOWN UNTO THE SPIRIT who inspired those men IS the understanding , wisdom of what IT INSPIRED . THUS TRUST in GOD , WE need ONLY HIS SPIRIT and it will teach us , give us all we need to understand WHAT IT INSPIRED . AKA we can learn and know what the bible means . I TRUST the SPIRIT , not man . OH let all be encouraged with this today .
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Post by frienduff on Dec 3, 2018 9:52:19 GMT -5
Let a man show me his understanding the scriptures through hermeneutics of men . AND I WILL SHOW THE WORLD my understanding SIMPLY BY THE SPIRIT . TRUST IN GOD . as a child , TRUST IN GOD , for known unto GOD are not some things , BUT ALL THINGS and in all times , from the beginning to the end HE KNOWS ALL . OH may this sink n deep today . be converted as small children and learn to trust ONLY IN GOD . NOW raise those hands and let us all honor and praise HE who is able to keep us from falling .
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PG4Him
Senior Member
Essay Moderator
Posts: 3,570
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Post by PG4Him on Dec 3, 2018 10:58:09 GMT -5
You all know I appreciate a good language study as much as the next girl, but even when we move back to Hebrew, we’re still in the arena of human tongue. Hebrew itself is not pure spirit. And anyway, I don’t believe God punished the Gentiles with deficient languages to force us all into Hebrew. To say that English can’t really give us God’s word is to say the English aren’t as good as the Jews. The veil has been removed from Gentile eyes, and God’s word is made manifest. The NT was written in Greek to demonstrate that very fact. It isn’t that Greek miraculously became a spiritual language, but that God’s word is now put upon Gentile lips. So enjoy a good rabbit hole down the depths of Hebrew, but I’m careful about worshipping Hebrew too much.
Let me also add one more thing here, and I’ll try to be diplomatic. This is NOT a personal attack on anyone here. I don’t know our members well enough to personally judge them. This is simply an observation of people in general. In my experience, advanced knowledge of Hebrew/Greek does not automatically grow the fruit of higher spiritual maturity. Most of the people in my life with strong spiritual authority were practical people who relied on an English Bible. I simply haven’t seen much evidence that Hebrew studies make us better Christians.
But again, Hebrew/Greek studies can bring value by adding more depth to Scripture. That’s a good thing. As long as we’re not making people question if they’re really getting the gospel in English.
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Post by John on Dec 3, 2018 12:29:50 GMT -5
You all know I appreciate a good language study as much as the next girl, but even when we move back to Hebrew, we’re still in the arena of human tongue. Hebrew itself is not pure spirit. And anyway, I don’t believe God punished the Gentiles with deficient languages to force us all into Hebrew. To say that English can’t really give us God’s word is to say the English aren’t as good as the Jews. The veil has been removed from Gentile eyes, and God’s word is made manifest. The NT was written in Greek to demonstrate that very fact. It isn’t that Greek miraculously became a spiritual language, but that God’s word is now put upon Gentile lips. So enjoy a good rabbit hole down the depths of Hebrew, but I’m careful about worshipping Hebrew too much. Let me also add one more thing here, and I’ll try to be diplomatic. This is NOT a personal attack on anyone here. I don’t know our members well enough to personally judge them. This is simply an observation of people in general. In my experience, advanced knowledge of Hebrew/Greek does not automatically grow the fruit of higher spiritual maturity. Most of the people in my life with strong spiritual authority were practical people who relied on an English Bible. I simply haven’t seen much evidence that Hebrew studies make us better Christians. But again, Hebrew/Greek studies can bring value by adding more depth to Scripture. That’s a good thing. As long as we’re not making people question if they’re really getting the gospel in English. That is a good observation about the New Testament being in Greek. I never looked at possible symbolism there.
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Post by Abby-Joy on Dec 3, 2018 12:36:54 GMT -5
Yes. It is a great pity that of all the conspiracies and fear mongering, the Christians seem to lead the pack. The newest Christians must be bombarded with this dichotomous set of ever deepening questions. I guess we have wavered from the path of, 'I will just preach Christ crucified...' “Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel… so that the cross of Christ would not be made void.” I don't know that Christians are starting these conspiracies. For the most part, I don't think that is the case. It is just that some are too quick to accept them without any real evidence. I think it is good to discuss them, because I know conspiracies take place all the time around us, and we shouldn't have our head in the sand, but before we are ready to take a huge leap of faith and accept something as wild as the Mandela Effect, there needs to be solid proof. What is so crazy about this one is that the conspiracy itself means there is no concrete proof, so it is all by faith.
I am still looking into what evidence is being presented, and I always try to keep an open mind, but even when I sought the Lord about this one, I felt like I was shown that it wasn't true. I am not saying God spoke to me and said it wasn't true, but I felt like he showed me that the real conspiracy was that we would not trust our Bible to be accurate. I know that most of the examples of so-called changes are not real. That is just from personal reading. It is getting to the place where anytime someone thinks they find something that contradicts or doesn't sound quite right to them, it is the Mandela Effect. That is very dangerous, which is why I started this thread. Frienduff is generally the one sounding warnings about things, but I felt like I had to sound the warning in this case.
I agree that most of the claimed "changes" are just faulty memory, or coming from someone who didn't read solely the KJV, so they had a mixed memory of what the verses say. For instance, I remember the word "stuff" in my bible since I was saved in 1986. I've seen claims that that word shouldn't have been there. There are many other examples like that. I spent hours upon hours (for months) copying Scriptures down on paper when I was a baby Christian and I only ever used the KJV. So a lot of these are in my memory. But there is still something to this "Mandela Effect."
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