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Post by John on Sept 5, 2020 18:13:26 GMT -5
There are many problems in the Christian Church today, but most of the issues are the result of not being in God's order. In this case, we are dealing with the Christian home. If we can all get this right, we will take a major step forward.
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Post by John on Sept 5, 2020 18:37:08 GMT -5
The first thing I want to do is start at the very beginning with the creation of the first man and woman. If we look at what it says in Genesis, it appears to me that the first man was created in the image of God, and his assignment was to take care of God's creation on earth. He was to have dominion over it and take care of it.
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. And to every beast of the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so. And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. Genesis 1:26-31
Some claim that the Bible has two creation accounts that contradict each other. That is completely false. What it does in Genesis chapter one is give a general account of the creation of the first man and the first woman, and in Genesis chapter two, we are filled in on more details. If you read Genesis chapter one, we can get the picture that man and woman were both created at the same time, but that is not the case. You have to go to Genesis chapter two in order to see the actual order of events. From Genesis 2:4-7
These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground. And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Now you see where it say that up until this time, there had been "no man to till the ground." This gives us the picture that this was something man was to do, till the ground, look after and manage things on the earth. What about the creation of woman? We see that when we jump down to Genesis 2:18
And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
Before we go any further, we already have the answer to why God created woman. He tells us here that 1. It was not good that the man should be alone, and 2. God would make him an help meet for him. Notice the way this is worded. We see that the purpose for woman is to be a companion for a man, and to be his helper. She was literally created "for him." She was not created to be his competitor or an independent person, but she was created especially to be his companion so he wouldn't be alone, and his helper. This flies in the face of feminism. In verses 19 and 20, it mentions how that man was given the task of naming all of the creatures on earth, but among them, there was not a suitable "help meet for him." As such, Genesis 2:21-25 says...
And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from the man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.
Man was created from the dust of the ground, and woman was created from the rib of the first man. There is no question that when a man knows a woman, they become physically one flesh, but it goes deeper than that. The woman was taken from the man's body, so a part of him was missing. When a man marries a woman, he is now one complete being again, and he and his wife are spiritually one flesh. That is a reason why two men or two women cannot be joined in a real marriage. The main point I want to make here is that we are given the reason for the creation of the man, to be in charge of God's creation earth, and the reason for the creation for the woman, to be a companion and helper to a husband. That is God's order. That is his intent. Anything contrary to this is against God's order and purpose, and when people started going away from this, and started trying to force the role of man on woman, and make them the same, the problems began. There is nothing here I wouldn't say publically, but I am posting it here so we can have an honest discussion without a bunch of backlash.
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Post by John on Sept 5, 2020 18:38:15 GMT -5
Before we deal with the fall of man, and the effects it had on the relationship between the man and the woman, I need to point out that 1 Corinthians chapter 11 addresses this subject, and re-affirms what I just said about why the woman was created. We can easily overlook this because most of the time when people are looking at 1 Corinthians 11, they are arguing over why it is not necessary to follow it's teachings about hair length and they overlook a bigger issue.
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. 1 Corinthians 11:3
This is God's established order. God the Father is head over all. Christ is next in authority. Then comes the man. Under the man is the woman. Of course, children are to be in subjection to their parents, which we see in other verses. We also recognize that the Holy Spirit is God, so naturally the Spirit is above man, but does the will of the Father and the Son. Anything that promotes things that go against God's order is rebellion. But now we come to the main point I want to make from 1 Corinthians chapter 11. Look at verses 8 and 9.
For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
The woman was taken out of man, his rib. He is not of her, but she is of him. He was not created for her, but the woman was created "for the man." She is to be his companion and help meet. That is her divine purpose. Again, any teaching that goes against this is promoting rebellion against God's order. That is why I will say that the feminist movement is of the devil. There is nothing good about it. Churches that promote it are doing the work of Satan.
To me, nothing I said thus far should even be in question. It is right there for all to see, but it is not received well by most of the church world. The typical reaction I get is that I am not to teach such things. This is what unbelievers say to turn people away from God. Some God haters do admit this is what the Bible teaches, but that doesn't make it wrong. What the modern day church is doing is sanitizing scripture to make Christianity acceptable in today's culture, and apologizing for God. Many know I am correct, but they have been working to cover up the truth so as not turn women away from the faith. I believe God knew what he was doing and we don't need to apologize for him.
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Post by John on Sept 5, 2020 18:39:13 GMT -5
We could examine all of Genesis chapter 3, but for the sake of time, I will only cover the main parts. We all know about how Lucifer convinced Eve to eat the forbidden fruit, and after she ate of it, she gave to Adam her husband, and he obeyed her voice over God's and did eat too. Verses 6 and 7 said...
And when the woman saw, that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her, and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened and they knew that they were naked, and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
This led to God's judgement upon them for their disobedience. Verses 16 through 19...
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow, and thy conception. In sorrow thou shalt bring forth children: and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake: in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life. Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee: and thou shalt eat the herb of the field. In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground: for out of it wast thou taken, for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
The woman has one set of curses placed on her and so does the man. Her curse belongs only to her and his curse only belongs to him. The woman is told that God will multiply her sorrow, and thy conception. She will have pain in child bearing that would not have existed had she not sinned. It will not be a pleasant experience when she brings forth children. Her desire will be to her husband, and he will rule over her. In other words, her purpose is to help her husband with his tasks in this life, and he is to rule over her. This isn't a departure from the original plan of God. God already intended for the woman to be a help meet, but before the fall, the husband and wife were in unity, so the ruling over part wasn't necessary in the sense of having to tell her to do things she didn't necessarily want to do. Before the fall, Adam and Eve were in unity as Christ is in unity with God the Father. Not so after the fall.
The man was always to be looking after and managing God's creation. He was here to till the ground. After the fall, this continued, but now it won't be easy. It will be difficult. Doing his job will be hard work, because the ground has been cursed. The man and woman will know physical death because they no longer have access to the tree of life, but the other curses are unique to them, and based on their original purpose. None of that changed under the New Testament. Women who promote feminism are actually fighting to take on the man's curse, and many women continue to live under their curse as well. We see God's order affirmed in New Testament scripture. 1 Timothy 2:11-15
Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection: But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve: And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression: Notwithstanding she shall be saved in child-bearing, if they continue in faith and charity, and holiness, with sobriety.
The first woman, Eve, was deceived by the serpent. Her husband was not deceived, but willingly chose to obey his wife over God. For that reason, the wife is not to be the spiritual leader in the home over her husband. That is his position. Adam was first formed, not Eve. Adam was not deceived, but Eve was deceived, and her transgression was convincing her husband to disobey God. She shall be saved based on following God's order of bearing children, continuing in the faith, showing love, and living a lifestyle of holiness and sobriety.
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Post by Tabitha3319 on Sept 5, 2020 19:26:01 GMT -5
A lot of feminists try to take the man out of the equation. They try to teach that a man is unnecessary.
I've always known this was harmful. Children need their Father. And wives need a husband with direction.
The Word of the Scriptures has always rang true to me and I always knew I wanted the man to lead in my marriage.
One time on this forum, I put it like this:
The man needs help and the woman's helpfulness needs direction.
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Post by John on Sept 5, 2020 19:31:43 GMT -5
The man needs help and the woman's helpfulness needs direction. I love the way you put that! Well said.
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