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Post by frienduff on Oct 11, 2018 9:10:04 GMT -5
The thing is believing we have no power over sin , is what keeps folks in bondage to that sin . Our faith must be in Christ and our trust in HIM.
HE said to those who believed in HIM , the truth shall make you free. We should trust in His every word . Our faith in HIM is how we overcome the evil .
But if our trust is in men , who keep saying we will always be a slave to sin , then our own unbelief rules us .
IF men , teachers and preachers tell their flocks or give the idea we will always be a slave to sin , THEN they always will be a slave to sin .
WE have to trust CHRIST and what the apostels said , who trusted in Christ .
Their approach to inquity , was LET it not ONCE be named among you . They pointed not to their own means to attain this , they said , FOR IT IS HE IN YOU
Working that which is well pleasing IN HIS SIGHT . and I think we all know SIN is not well pleasing in His sight .
IF we but teach the truth , folks would CRY OUT to the one who is able to deliver them from captivity . AND HE WOULD HEAR .
Our trust , hope and faith , must be IN CHRIST . Let no man , woman or child , DOUBT the power of the blood . Let them receive the TRUTH
and let them be REMINDED their is a savoir in the heavens , by whose SPIRIT we are able to crucify the flesh . POINT TO JESUS and let us expound
to all, to put their trust and hope and all affections above on Him . To believe that the grace HE gives us IN CHRIST can truly bring every
thought even , captive to the obedience of Christ . But if men trust not Christ , nor those apostles WHO did KNOW HIM , they are doomed to captivity of sin .
WE must as children TRUST IN CHRIST , and realize that sin will always be present in our flesh , BUT that the POWER of CHRIST is greater than our flesh .
THUS we have a way out of EVERY TEMPTATION , a way to overcome every temptation, HIS NAME .................JESUS the FREER OF SLAVES the BREAKER OF the chains of bondage That HE ALONE is able to keep us from falling . But if our trust , faith and hope is not in HIM, we fail and do fall .
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Post by Giller on Oct 11, 2018 12:33:56 GMT -5
Absolutely brother, we do have power over sin.
I know that sometimes preachers will say that we cannot help but sin, but that is not the message that Christ tells to us.
Now in saying that, it is not that we preach sinless perfection either, or that we have attained, which I know that is not what you are saying brother Frienduff.
1Jn 1:8-10 (8) If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (9) If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. (10) If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
But even though we sin at times, does not mean that we do not have the power to overcome sin, through Christ.
And it does not mean that we have to sin, even though we do, because we are not yet perfect.
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Post by frienduff on Oct 11, 2018 13:12:09 GMT -5
Absolutely brother, we do have power over sin. I know that sometimes preachers will say that we cannot help but sin, but that is not the message that Christ tells to us. Now in saying that, it is not that we preach sinless perfection either, or that we have attained, which I know that is not what you are saying brother Frienduff. 1Jn 1:8-10 (8) If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (9) If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. (10) If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. But even though we sin at times, does not mean that we do not have the power to overcome sin, through Christ. And it does not mean that we have to sin, even though we do, because we are not yet perfect. Its also how the early church approached sin and error that was and is so different than we see today . Their calls echoed JESUS who had said GO and sin no more lest something worse come upon you . You can see this in pauls approach . LET not inquity be once named among you as becometh saints . They saw both the dire danger in sin , and that while one walked in an error , not only were they a danger to themselves but to others too . As in don't you know a little leaven can leaven the whole lump . PURGE OUT , separate out the sinner , TILL they repent of course . I mean , giller, its a madhouse of delusion today . As you KNOW full well giller . BUT WE GOING TO FOLLOW JESUS and the true pattern In all things . FOR THE GRACE OF GOD compels us , OH YES , the grace of GOD COMPELS US , OBEY THE SON or risk all . FOLLOW the one who saves , OR RISK ALL AND THAT is HOW DIRE I see it , by GODS GRACE of COURSE . Giller take note , I give myself no credit , I POINT TO JESUS and say its by HIS Grace . AND THIS you know too . THOSE WHO ARE HIS , KNOW FULLY BY HIS GRACE , we can not boast in ourselves , BUT ONLY IN THE LORD . OH YES GILLER , YOU SING IT TOO . YOU LOVED GILLER . And in all honesty and sincerity , I fully don't care what the pope and others would say about ya , I LOVES YA . WE GOING TO KEEP ON IN THE LORD BY HIS GRACE which gives us All we need IN JESUS TO OVERCOME ALL EVIL THAT IS IN THE WORLD AND OUR OWN FLESH TOO . SING IT GILLER ./ OH YES WE GOT ALL HOPE . Only let us continue IN THAT HOPE which is CHRIST by the power of the grace of GOD which is given us in no other name , ONLY IN JESUS . The true saints have a war that now is and will get far worse coming against us . Many , gilbert , not some will die in the time which is to come for simply remaining loyal to JESUS ONLY and not this all inculsvie mindset that leads and is leading all to the beast . WE GOT THE HOPE GILLER , WE DO , CAUSE WE GOT THE AUTHOR OF ALL HOPE , the KING JESUS . OH its LORD PRAISING and hand raising TIME TO THE LORD . My soul is on fire , OH SING TO THE LORD GILLER , SING , and whether we live or die , PRAISE THE LORD we are HIS .
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Post by 2fw8212a on Oct 11, 2018 13:22:19 GMT -5
Now in saying that, it is not that we preach sinless perfection either... People often mistake sinless perfection with the ability to choose not to sin when an opportunity is shown.
Bondage is characterized by this (as far as I know):
the person is unable to avoid sin, and sin overcomes them; and this happens in a regular manner.
"...Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. ...Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed." - John 8:34,36
If anyone is in such state, seek and pray, and the bondage will soon be broken.
"Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good." - Romans 12:21
"Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth." - John 17:17
The problem is when people put limits to the ability of overcoming sin.
There is no limit, the only limit is your faith.
"I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." - Philippians 4:13
The person has to learn and walk in the Spirit, and keep walking, once such is achieved, it becomes natural.
"Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall." - 1 Corinthians 10:12
It is not to take the above Scripture with fear, there is no fear in love.
Fear to fall to sin is common when we are not still very mature, but once we grow more in love it becomes much easier, more natural, and fearless.
"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment..." - 1 John 4:18
"For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments..." - 1 John 5:3
"...if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law." - Galatians 5:18
"Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law." - Romans 13:10
"He who does not love does not know God, for God is love." - 1 John 4:8
"I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh." - Galatians 5:16
"But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you..." - Romans 8:9
Blessings, blessings in Jesus' name!
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Post by Giller on Oct 12, 2018 9:45:46 GMT -5
I know a certain person, who is quite a bit into attaining to sinless perfection on earth.
And lately they have been entertaining a thought that maybe we no longer even have a sin nature.
Now that is dangerous thinking.
One thing I know is this, as long as we are on earth, we can always grow deeper in the things of God, there is no limit to growth in Christ, but that does not mean that on earth that one can one day say they have attained.
Even the apostle Paul did not attain.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Oct 12, 2018 10:21:44 GMT -5
I know a certain person, who is quite a bit into attaining to sinless perfection on earth. And lately they have been entertaining a thought that maybe we no longer even have a sin nature. Now that is dangerous thinking. One thing I know is this, as long as we are on earth, we can always grow deeper in the things of God, there is no limit to growth in Christ, but that does not mean that on earth that one can one day say they have attained. Even the apostle Paul did not attain. I am saying that the limit is our faith.
"Jesus said to him, If you can believe, all things are possible to him who believes." - Mark 9:23
I am not saying that we have to reach perfection on Earth in order to be saved.
We are saved by grace through faith, not perfection.
"Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ..." - Romans 5:1
"Nevertheless, to the degree that we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us be of the same mind." - Philippians 3:16
"For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more." - Luke 12:48
For example, I cannot require people to live in the same way I live when they have not attained it.
All I can do is encourage them to pursue the level I have attained.
"...but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead..." - Philippians 3:13
Just to make things clear. Blessings!
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Cletus
Senior Member
Posts: 2,517
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Post by Cletus on Oct 12, 2018 22:10:51 GMT -5
I heard a preacher in a holiness church once teach that we can come to a place where we can say we have no sin... because of the Jesus in us. He said many wont or cant understand it. or reach that point in their walk. There was a brother there who would not accept that and quoted if we say we have no sin we call God a liar. that is a real scary thought isnt it?... to call The Holy One a liar... the One who none can deliver you out of His hand. that thought does not make me tremble inwardly, it makes me draw backwards like when you see a snake and are trying to avoid it. this thread did make me think of that song chain breaker... you know it? If you’ve been walking the same old road for miles and miles If you’ve been hearing the same old voice tell the same old lies If you’re trying to feel the same old holes inside There’s a better life There’s a better life If you’ve got pain He’s a pain taker If you feel lost He’s a way maker If you need freedom or saving He’s a prison-shaking Savior If you’ve got chains He’s a chain breaker We’ve all search for the light of day in the dead of night We’ve all found ourselves worn out from the same old fight We’ve all run to things we know just ain’t right And there’s a better life There’s a better life
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Post by frienduff on Oct 12, 2018 23:15:44 GMT -5
I heard a preacher in a holiness church once teach that we can come to a place where we can say we have no sin... because of the Jesus in us. He said many wont or cant understand it. or reach that point in their walk. There was a brother there who would not accept that and quoted if we say we have no sin we call God a liar. that is a real scary thought isnt it?... to call The Holy One a liar... the One who none can deliver you out of His hand. that thought does not make me tremble inwardly, it makes me draw backwards like when you see a snake and are trying to avoid it. this thread did make me think of that song chain breaker... you know it? If you’ve been walking the same old road for miles and miles If you’ve been hearing the same old voice tell the same old lies If you’re trying to feel the same old holes inside There’s a better life There’s a better life If you’ve got pain He’s a pain taker If you feel lost He’s a way maker If you need freedom or saving He’s a prison-shaking Savior If you’ve got chains He’s a chain breaker We’ve all search for the light of day in the dead of night We’ve all found ourselves worn out from the same old fight We’ve all run to things we know just ain’t right And there’s a better life There’s a better life Cletus , you loved brother . SING TO THE LORD . and PRAISE THE LORD one and all .
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Post by 2fw8212a on Oct 13, 2018 6:13:14 GMT -5
I heard a preacher in a holiness church once teach that we can come to a place where we can say we have no sin... because of the Jesus in us.
He said many wont or cant understand it. or reach that point in their walk.
There was a brother there who would not accept that and quoted if we say we have no sin we call God a liar. that is a real scary thought isnt it? I believe to say we have no sin in that passage of John means to reject Christ because you see yourself as a righteous person in the sight of God.
I believe to say we have no sin means that, we have no sins, even on past we can say we have not sinned.
And obviously, this removes the need for a savior for such person.
When people reach a point in their walk that they cannot say the last time they have sinned in a period of time, well, I cannot say they are lying.
"...if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin." - 1 John 1:7
"Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ..." - Romans 5:1
"how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?" - Hebrews 9:14
And the person who have the Holy Spirit will always give glory to Jesus Christ.
"He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you." - John 16:14
"I am the Lord, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images." - Isaiah 42:8
It is a matter of faith, if they say they have absolutely no sin then it is a different story.
And the Spirit of God cannot be in a person who claims they have no sin, as such is not true.
"...for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God..." - Romans 3:23
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Cletus
Senior Member
Posts: 2,517
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Post by Cletus on Oct 13, 2018 10:55:15 GMT -5
I heard a preacher in a holiness church once teach that we can come to a place where we can say we have no sin... because of the Jesus in us.
He said many wont or cant understand it. or reach that point in their walk.
There was a brother there who would not accept that and quoted if we say we have no sin we call God a liar. that is a real scary thought isnt it? I believe to say we have no sin in that passage of John means to reject Christ because you see yourself as a righteous person in the sight of God.
I believe to say we have no sin means that, we have no sins, even on past we can say we have not sinned.
And obviously, this removes the need for a savior for such person.
When people reach a point in their walk that they cannot say the last time they have sinned in a period of time, well, I cannot say they are lying.
"...if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin." - 1 John 1:7
"Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ..." - Romans 5:1
"how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?" - Hebrews 9:14
And the person who have the Holy Spirit will always give glory to Jesus Christ.
"He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you." - John 16:14
"I am the Lord, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images." - Isaiah 42:8
It is a matter of faith, if they say they have absolutely no sin then it is a different story.
And the Spirit of God cannot be in a person who claims they have no sin, as such is not true.
"...for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God..." - Romans 3:23we sin a lot more than we realize. its just God hasnt showed us all of it. I heard an older man in church speak once about something God showed him was a sin he did. it was very subtle. something most folks do and dont think about. something common. but as He spoke not only was there silence in the sanctuary but your could feel the collective spirit of the congregation humbly bowing down realizing they too do this. myself not excluded. this older man was at least in his 80's. this man was one who you could watch and study and not be able to point to something that he does that is sin.
If God showed us all of our sin at one time we would all probably have a mental meltdown from such a great sense of failure.
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