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Post by tlsitd on Sept 11, 2018 16:18:36 GMT -5
WHAT IS FAITH?
(I'm going to open up this can of worms, and pray that God brings good out of it. It's in His hands.)
This what I believe about faith.
There are four kinds of faith:
SAVING FAITH - The God-given ability to believe in Jesus Christ with our heart (spirit), which results in spiritual regeneration (being born again/saved), and is by the power of God (grace) that draws us to God and enables us to believe unto salvation, which belief He also sustains by grace.
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. (Ephesians 2:8,9)
Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. (Hebrews 11:1)
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to His great mercy, He has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time...Though you have not seen Him, you love Him. Though you do not now see Him, you believe in Him and rejoice with joy that is inexpressible and filled with glory, obtaining the outcome of your faith, the salvation of your souls. (1 Peter 1:3-5, 8,9)
THE CHRISTIAN FAITH - The doctrine and religion of Christianity.
...One Lord, one faith, one baptism... (Ephesians 4:5)
...Strengthening the souls of the disciples, encouraging them to continue in the faith, and saying that through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God. (Acts 14:22)
Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints. (Jude 3)
Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith, not devoting themselves to Jewish myths and the commands of people who turn away from the truth. (Titus 1:13,14)
TRUSTING FAITH - Trust in God.
This is general trust in God to do what He says He will do in His word and in His sovereignty and character, according to what is written about Him in the same word, which we have in Him as we go about our lives: Trusting God to do what is best for us, or to keep us safe, or to provide for our needs day to day.
"But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is alive and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?" (Matthew 6:30)
PERSONAL FAITH - The knowledge and conviction of God's truth and of His will for us personally about a particular thing.
This kind of faith encompasses a variety of things, from our conviction about Scriptural truth (knowing with certainty that something is correct and true), to how we live out the teachings of the Scriptures, to personal knowledge of something that God is going to do that He makes known to our spirit by revelation and conviction. It's the same kind of faith by which we are saved, just working for different purposes.
Matters of personal faith may not be contained in the Scriptures (such as knowing that it is God's will to marry someone, or to work or live in a particular place, or that a particular person needs prayer), but its convictions will never contradict the teachings of God's word, because both come from the same Spirit, and God doesn't contradict Himself.
If God gives us the faith to know something He is going to do by personal revelation and conviction, He acts according to what He makes known. (This is the kind of faith that can potentially move a mountain or enable a person to walk on water; it's more than the general trusting God kind of faith. I can trust God with all of my heart, but if I step out onto a lake, I'm most likely going to sink, unless I know for sure that God wants me to step out there and is going to enable me to stand on the water, which He would have to make known to me and assure me of by His Spirit before I'd do it. God does act according to our trust in Him to do things sometimes when we don't have such a conviction, but it's not guaranteed that He is going to do what we are trusting Him for---such as healing a loved one who is dying. He might or He might not.)
By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible. (Hebrews 11:3)
By faith Noah, being warned by God concerning events as yet unseen, in reverent fear constructed an ark for the saving of his household. (Hebrews 11:7)
By faith Joseph, at the end of his life, made mention of the exodus of the Israelites and gave instructions about his bones. (Hebrews 11:22)
As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables...One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives to himself and none of us dies to himself. If we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. (Romans 14:1,2,5-8)
The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who has no reason to pass judgment on himself by what he approves. But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin. (Romans 14:22,23)
The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. "For who has understood the mind of the Lord so as to instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ. (1 Corinthians 2:15,16) That discernment and knowledge of God's will is what directs (or should direct) how every Christian lives day to day, the judgments we make by the guidance and conviction of the Holy Spirit---the mind of Christ: How we dress, what we say to others and how we say it, what we do with our time, the choices we make about various things, what we feed our eyes and ears and how we treat our bodies---as well as personal callings or ministries, doing what we know God wants us to do in the way He wants us to.
All of the "faith" described in the Bible falls under one of those four categories, although there may be some overlap in some places. I think these four cover everything. It's important to know what kind of faith the Bible is speaking of when we read it, as that understanding affects what we believe the Scriptures teach about things; and confusing or confounding one kind of faith with another when we read the Bible is problematic both for our understanding of the Scriptures' teachings, and also how we act according to our beliefs about what they teach that faith is and how it works.
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Post by 2fw8212a on Sept 11, 2018 16:27:16 GMT -5
I believe faith is a perfect assurance in someone or something.
As with everything that is good and perfect, it comes only from God.
There is no doubt in faith.
"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." - Hebrews 11:1
Everyone has a measure of faith given to them by God.
One can have the faith to move mountains, heal a sick, or even walk in the Spirit in a higher degree of trust.
Faith is always the same, it is perfect assurance. What changes is the scope, and everyone has a scope their current faith can handle.
As a result, some have faith to do more than others.
"For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith." - Romans 12:3
"But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift." - Ephesians 4:7
Blessings to you all in Jesus' name!
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Post by Abby-Joy on Sept 11, 2018 17:25:06 GMT -5
I really appreciate this post on faith ... it is very timely!! I'll come back to this later...
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Post by frienduff on Sept 11, 2018 18:13:38 GMT -5
You remember how peter told the church we have the more sure word of prophecy , and john said we have both SEEN and we witness what we have seen . FOLKS when one can never have seen. YET ACTUALLY KNOWS BONE DEEP , and I mean KNOWS That GOD IS REAL and JESUS is the ONLY WAY . you know why they KNOW THAT , BECAUSE GOD REALLY IS AT WORK IN THEM . aint no head knowledge , ITS THE REAL WORK OF THE HOLY GHOST . WHEN I say I KNOW , Its not a feeling or a concept I MEAN I KNOW GOD IS REAL and JESUS IS THE ONLY WAY and I know it , BECUASE HIS SPIRIT is at work and it LED ME right into that BIBLE . see its more than head knowledge and second guesses . IF GOD , IF THE SPIRIT of JESUS really is in you . BELIEVING BECOMES KNOWING . KNOWING for HE REALLY is in those who are HIS . NOW , feast on them bibles . and KNOW and UNDERSTAND by the SPIRIT , that , JESUS were just some wise man who knew a lot , OH NO , way more . When He came to die on a piece of wood YET had made the HILL on which is stood , IS more than just a song but truly understood . Thomas is long long gone . as in the doubter . THOMAS had to see him RESSURECTED to honestly believe He was . BUT JESUS said BLESSED aer THOSE WHO have never seen , YET TRULY BELIEVE . How can a man believe something he has not seen. I leave us with JESUS words to peter. BLESSED aer you Simeon FOR flesh has not revealed this to you BUT MY FATHER WHO IS IN HEAVEN. OH YES , ponder on that real deep and long .
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Post by frienduff on Sept 11, 2018 18:48:18 GMT -5
That is right sister abby . You loved dear sister . IF we know anything , ITS ONLY BECAUSE GOD REVEALED IT . Makes being saved by grace a whole lot easier to see DONT IT . But , on that same note , by that same spirit that even revelead that to me , Lets remember its the same spirit that rips at the throat of doctines gone wrong too. SPIRIT , I assure us , aint well pleased with this unity inclusive move . that is saying it real lite too . The SPIRIT stirs us yes it does . Let us learn JESUS well. Heeding the Grace of our LORD , FOR It is HE working in us that which is well pleasing in HIS SIGHT . I mean what we would know if it were not for the grace of GOD , had not the grace of GOD revealed it to us . AND the SPIRIT of GOD alone is what draws us to CHRIST . And the grace of GOD given us in Christ , we got all we need . OH praise the LORD we got all we need , if even we lived in a cave . OH PRAISE THE LORD HE IS ALL WE NEED . Makes a mute man sing . Now lets raise those hands and praise the LORD . and do remember , LET US HEED THE SPIRIT and not the flesh . Be on guard and look out for another too . Cause mass deceivers do abound and this unity peace thing , its only gonna get worse . SO , lets agree to AGREE on sound bible doctrine and do all to keep working out any thing men may have taught that was contrary to REAL DOCTRINE . PRAISE THE LORD folks .
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Post by tlsitd on Sept 12, 2018 5:19:06 GMT -5
You remember how peter told the church we have the more sure word of prophecy , and john said we have both SEEN and we witness what we have seen . FOLKS when one can never have seen. YET ACTUALLY KNOWS BONE DEEP , and I mean KNOWS That GOD IS REAL and JESUS is the ONLY WAY . you know why they KNOW THAT , BECAUSE GOD REALLY IS AT WORK IN THEM . aint no head knowledge , ITS THE REAL WORK OF THE HOLY GHOST . WHEN I say I KNOW , Its not a feeling or a concept I MEAN I KNOW GOD IS REAL and JESUS IS THE ONLY WAY and I know it , BECUASE HIS SPIRIT is at work and it LED ME right into that BIBLE . see its more than head knowledge and second guesses . IF GOD , IF THE SPIRIT of JESUS really is in you . BELIEVING BECOMES KNOWING . KNOWING for HE REALLY is in those who are HIS . NOW , feast on them bibles . and KNOW and UNDERSTAND by the SPIRIT , that , JESUS were just some wise man who knew a lot , OH NO , way more . When He came to die on a piece of wood YET had made the HILL on which is stood , IS more than just a song but truly understood . Thomas is long long gone . as in the doubter . THOMAS had to see him RESSURECTED to honestly believe He was . BUT JESUS said BLESSED aer THOSE WHO have never seen , YET TRULY BELIEVE . How can a man believe something he has not seen. I leave us with JESUS words to peter. BLESSED aer you Simeon FOR flesh has not revealed this to you BUT MY FATHER WHO IS IN HEAVEN. OH YES , ponder on that real deep and long . Yes, one thing that really bothers me about the way some people preach the gospel is that they tell people to just "trust" in Christ to save them---as though if they really believe with their minds that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that He is going to save them from hell, and believe that they ARE saved, that they are born again. But the Bible doesn't say that if we believe in our heads we will be saved but that if we believe in our hearts (spirits) we will be saved. And we can only do that if God enables us to believe in that way by His grace. It's not head belief---willing ourselves to believe something and convincing ourselves of it, like people can convince themselves of other things if they say it enough or really want to believe it enough---we believe because we KNOW, because God has convicted and convinced our hearts and given us that assurance. That's a whole different thing than believing a fact with your head and trusting God to save you.
My trust in God is not a human hope that I'm going to go to heaven when I die. That would be no faith at all. I know that I'm going to go to heaven when I die. If I died in the next five seconds I know that I would go to heaven and not hell, and not because someone told me so, or because I am willing myself to believe this, but because I know that Jesus Christ lives in me.
By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit. (1 John 4:13)
But the person who is just trusting God to save him but has no assurance from God doesn't have saving faith, he just has human hope. Making yourself believe that you are saved doesn't save you. Hoping that you are saved doesn't save you. Faith is God-given assurance of salvation, not self-induced belief. We believe because we know for certain that what God has said about His Son is true---by a supernatural spiritual conviction, not mental persuasion---because His Spirit has convinced us. We know that He is in us because we experience of His Spirit those same things that are written in His word---the attitudes and the desires and the understanding, and the power to overcome sin.
It's a dangerous thing to tell a person that saving faith is just trusting God to save one.
When I was young, I was instructed by my father (a pastor) to pray the "sinner's prayer", and was assured by him and my mother and other Christians that I was saved for doing it. The implication was that any doubts on my part thenceforth were just the result of weak faith, because I really was saved. The truth was, I was not saved, and was being told by others that I was. It didn't matter how many times I prayed that prayer (and I did so more than once) or trusted that Jesus was going to save me from hell; I was still afraid of going to hell, and the only assurance I had of going to heaven was thinking and hoping that I would, because I had prayed that prayer and was a "Christian" by religious affiliation and upbringing, and in my own mind.
Could I have talked myself out of that fear and persuaded myself with Scripture or positive thinking that I was saved? Perhaps. But I still would not have been. All the trust in the world isn't going to save a person who isn't saved by God. And that's entirely by God's mercy and power, and is supernatural, not something that people can obtain by willing their minds to believe something, or hoping that it's true.
That's where the heresy of "Nobody can really know for sure whether they're saved or not" comes from. That lie (and it is a lie) is something that "evangelists" who want large numbers of converts tell people, or "pastors" who want a large congregation ($), or false churches, like the Roman Catholic "church", who want more converts ($). It's a lie that is told to give comfort and hope to people who aren't truly saved. They're "trusting" and hoping that God is going to save them, in vain. And on the day of judgment, Jesus will say to them, "I never knew you."
This is one of the reasons why faith is an important term to define, Scripturally, and why it's important to stick with the Scriptural definitions and explanations of it---no matter how many people that disappoints or angers. So that folks can't mislead people into thinking that the faith that saves is trusting God with their mind and hoping that He's going to save them, and so that people who are so deceived may actually get saved in truth.
We'd better be very careful to tell people what "Believing" really is, and not just take a few Scriptures that talk about believing in Christ and use them for our evangelism (such as "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved" or "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved"). The belief that saves is spiritual conviction and assurance by the power of God, not mental persuasion by the power of man.
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Post by Abby-Joy on Sept 12, 2018 5:52:54 GMT -5
This is true... we believe with the heart unto salvation:
Romans 10:9, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Romans 10:10, "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."
Acts 8:36-38 36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
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Post by tlsitd on Sept 12, 2018 6:01:37 GMT -5
Another thing, sort of related to what I said in my last post, is how this same kind of confusion and confounding of kinds of faith is used by some Christians to teach false doctrines like "name it and claim it" or to guarantee healing to people who just "have faith".
Again, the flaw here is that the "faith" is self-induced. They use the word faith, but what they really mean by it is more like "the power of positive thinking" or wizardry of some kind---that if a human being really believes with his or her mind that something is going to happen, he or she can compel God to act according to that belief: God obeying the will of man. Man is the real god in such cases, and God is his servant.
Or, they apply the trusting in God kind of faith to things that it really doesn't apply to. When we are merely trusting God to do something---like the examples given in the OP---but have no God-given personal conviction and knowledge that He is actually going to it, there is no guarantee that He is going to do what we are trusting Him to do. He might, or He might not. And if He doesn't, it's because it isn't His will to do it, not because the person didn't "believe" enough to receive whatever he or she asked for.
God didn't say to that specific person's spirit: "I'm going to heal you" and assure that person of it, and the person just didn't believe Him. He didn't say He was going to heal them; the person just wanted Him to and believed that He was going to do it, and other people told him or her that God was going to do it. But if it's not God's will to do something, it doesn't matter how many people agree that God will do it, or how much a person believes that He is going to do something; it's not going to happen unless it is actually God's will.
(If I "believe" as hard as I possibly can that God is going to give me a thousand dollars in an envelope on my doorstep tomorrow, can I make Him do it? And if He doesn't, was my "faith" just weak? Or was it just not God's will to do this for me?)
While the confusion and misuse of the term and definitions of faith in this way is not necessarily as damaging as doing the same with salvation, it can and still does harm to Christians---both by creating a wrong idea of God in their minds, and with it a wrong way of living as Christians that is not pleasing to God or beneficial to them spiritually, and by doing more damage to people who may already be suffering by telling them that the reason they aren't healed or don't receive what they ask for is because they don't believe enough, rather than because when we're merely trusting God to do something, He might do it or He might not, depending on whether or not it's His will for us at that time, or ever.
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Post by frienduff on Sept 12, 2018 8:41:52 GMT -5
It's a dangerous thing to tell a person that saving faith is just trusting God to save one.
SISTER LIGHTS we should DO this . THIS is the basis of our whole gospel . BUT we also need to instruct those who do believe this TO continue on IN CHRIST < to read SOUND doctrine and to be on guard against the flesh and follow only the SPIRIT . but THIS telling a person that saving faith means to trust in GOD to save one . IS THE WHOLE OF THE GOSPLE . don't over analyze the simple . The main part of all the teaching of the apostels , WHILE IT WAS BIG TIME ON CORRECTION IT WAS HUGE on reminding and pointing to CHRIST alone who saves us and IS the ONE who can keep us from FALLING. I look not at a person who says JESUS is savoir and assume one way or the other whether or not they have saving faith, WHAT I LOOK at , IS DO THEY FOLLOW THIS JESUS they claim saved them . THAT IS where you will spot their faith. IF faith has not works IT IS DEAD .
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Post by frienduff on Sept 12, 2018 8:48:21 GMT -5
Does that make sense Everyone . WHEN we look at one who claims to have the saving Faith of JESUS , we don't assume one way or the other whether they are or not . WHAT WE DO is examine their walk , their faith , BY WHO THEY HEAR AND WHO THE FOLLOW , are they hearers ONLY deceiving their own selves OR are they TRULY of the saving faith , which hears and does , its a hearer and a DOER of the word . I HOPE that is plainly said . THIS is what we look at , DO they REALLY FOLLOW the LAMB or is it in vain . THE ONLY WAY to KNOW that IS you shall know them by their fruits . a hearer only and not a doer of the word , THEIR FATIH IS VAIN , its dead . THAT is how we know and this is how we remind and stir up the TRUE SAVING FAITH of our LORD . WE correct , remind , rebuke , encourage , BUT ITS JESUS WE POINTING TOO ITS HIM we point to. WE REMIND BE NOT HEAERES ONLY deceiving yourselves , OR truly your faith is dead , its not saving faith . FOR saving faith TRULY DOES TRUST IN CHRIST , SAVING FAITH , which truly does come by HEARING and hearing by the WORD , is going to OBEY that WORD , CHRIST , and be doers of the word . OR their faith is vain . its dead . So lets not over think any thing . SAVING FAITH , IS TRUSTING IN JESUS WHO DOES SAVE and CAN KEEP US FROM FALLLING . it is the work of GOD and it comes by Grace . ONLY Let us follow the SPIRIT , OBEYING the ONE who works within all who believe and trust in HIM .
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Sept 12, 2018 8:59:04 GMT -5
Paul tells us in Romans 12 that faith is measured out to each man. It is literally a gift from God. No human can manufacture his/her own faith. We can mentally choose to believe something, and it's not necessarily bad to accept good doctrine on face value until you receive a revelation of it. If we don't understand the Trinity, for example, we can accept it as fact while we pray for God to help us understand. But faith doesn't start until the revelation comes.
I suspect this is why Paul spoke on sins of personal conviction. We can only operate spiritually within our capacity of faith. When we make ourselves operate in liberty we don't understand, it's the same as saying we don't need the Spirit to give us liberty; we shall liberate ourselves. If I'm doing something that makes me uncomfortable to try to prove my liberty, I'm being awfully foolish. It sounds bad when you say it out loud. But Christians do this all the time without thinking it through. Either we're serious about relying on Jesus for our liberty, or we aren't.
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Post by tlsitd on Sept 12, 2018 9:05:07 GMT -5
It's a dangerous thing to tell a person that saving faith is just trusting God to save one. SISTER LIGHTS we should DO this . THIS is the basis of our whole gospel . BUT we also need to instruct those who do believe this TO continue on IN CHRIST < to read SOUND doctrine and to be on guard against the flesh and follow only the SPIRIT . but THIS telling a person that saving faith means to trust in GOD to save one . IS THE WHOLE OF THE GOSPLE . don't over analyze the simple . The main part of all the teaching of the apostels , WHILE IT WAS BIG TIME ON CORRECTION IT WAS HUGE on reminding and pointing to CHRIST alone who saves us and IS the ONE who can keep us from FALLING. I look not at a person who says JESUS is savoir and assume one way or the other whether or not they have saving faith, WHAT I LOOK at , IS DO THEY FOLLOW THIS JESUS they claim saved them . THAT IS where you will spot their faith. IF faith has not works IT IS DEAD . Whether a person has saving faith or just head belief is known to God. Even if we tell a person that to be saved they need to repent of their sins and put their faith in Jesus Christ, without giving them any explanation of what that faith means, God might save them, if it's His will. He doesn't require a perfect explanation of faith to work. I didn't understand what saving faith was when Jesus saved me; He just did it. The understanding of what that faith is came later, after studying the Scriptures and being taught about it, but that knowledge didn't save me. I doubt that most people who get saved have an understanding of what saving faith is when they do. It's something that God gives a person and that we respond according to, and He can give that faith to anyone anywhere at anytime, even if the gospel message they are preached or that is shared with them isn't doctrinally perfect. If it's God's will and God's time, He'll save the person in spite of those things. The problem is giving assurance to people who aren't sure---or to people who are sure, but their attitudes and lives testify to the fact that they don't really have what they think they have, because their fruit is not the fruit of the Spirit. I gave the personal example of what happened to me, with people telling me that I was saved when I had no such assurance from God, just because I prayed a prayer. What I had was not faith, and encouraging me to believe something that wasn't true was harmful to me, not helpful. If I had kept trusting God in that state, and telling myself or being told by others that my uncertainty was just weak faith, or that my self deception was faith (I was no Christian) I would have wound up in hell.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Sept 12, 2018 9:08:41 GMT -5
It's a dangerous thing to tell a person that saving faith is just trusting God to save one. SISTER LIGHTS we should DO this . THIS is the basis of our whole gospel . BUT we also need to instruct those who do believe this TO continue on IN CHRIST < to read SOUND doctrine and to be on guard against the flesh and follow only the SPIRIT . but THIS telling a person that saving faith means to trust in GOD to save one . IS THE WHOLE OF THE GOSPLE . don't over analyze the simple . The main part of all the teaching of the apostels , WHILE IT WAS BIG TIME ON CORRECTION IT WAS HUGE on reminding and pointing to CHRIST alone who saves us and IS the ONE who can keep us from FALLING. I look not at a person who says JESUS is savoir and assume one way or the other whether or not they have saving faith, WHAT I LOOK at , IS DO THEY FOLLOW THIS JESUS they claim saved them . THAT IS where you will spot their faith. IF faith has not works IT IS DEAD . Whether a person has saving faith or just head belief is known to God. Even if we tell a person that to be saved they need to repent of their sins and put their faith in Jesus Christ, without giving them any explanation of what that faith means, God might save them, if it's His will. He doesn't require a perfect explanation of faith to work. I didn't understand what saving faith was when Jesus saved me; He just did it. The understanding of what that faith is came later, after studying the Scriptures and being taught about it, but that knowledge didn't save me. I doubt that most people who get saved have an understanding of what saving faith is when they do. It's something that God gives a person and that we respond according to, and He can give that faith to anyone anywhere at anytime, even if the gospel message they are preached or that is shared with them isn't doctrinally perfect. If it's God's will and God's time, He'll save the person in spite of those things. The problem is giving assurance to people who aren't sure---or to people who are sure, but their attitudes and lives testify to the fact that they don't really have what they think they have, because their fruit is not the fruit of the Spirit. I gave the personal example of what happened to me, with people telling me that I was saved when I had no such assurance from God, just because I prayed a prayer. What I had was not faith, and encouraging me to believe something that wasn't true was harmful to me, not helpful. If I had kept trusting God in that state, and telling myself or being told by others that my uncertainty was just weak faith, or that my self deception was faith (I was no Christian) I would have wound up in hell. Saving faith really is quite simple. You know it when it hits you. No fancy words, no deep theology. You just know. Even if you can't explain who Jesus is or what He did, you know He is Lord. That's how He saved me.
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PG4Him
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Post by PG4Him on Sept 12, 2018 9:25:05 GMT -5
And He will take you back to the basics real quick. Everything you thought you knew about life is undone. Your view of the whole world changes overnight. What you *thought* the gospel was about goes flying out the window. You’re like a child who must learn her ABCs all over again.
Now I’m getting chills just remembering! Thank you for starting this thread!
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Post by John on Sept 12, 2018 9:28:20 GMT -5
If you repented of your sins, believe in Jesus and asked him to save you, and do not turn back, you are saved. The devil can come along and cause a real Christian to have doubts. The Lord won't turn anyone away that comes to him seeking salvation if they are willing to follow him. In addition, if you did turn back into sin and are truly sorry, confess those sins to God and he promises to forgive you.
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